A little truth about dyno figures

  • sherriff
    sherriff
    1 year ago
    For all fellow Harley owners who believe they have huge horsepower after having new engines built and getting them dyno tuned.
     It's sad to say, but the industry in this country is becoming poorly represented by car and motorcycle dyno shops that prey on uninformed people by producing false results to boost their reputations in the public sector in order to lure in more unsuspecting customers.
     Industry standard dyno's for motorcycles when properly calibrated and given correct  atmospheric info are designed to give correct horsepower and torque figures when bikes are run at full throttle in fourth gear when the relationship between engine and rear wheel are at the optimum ratio for for producing these figures accurately.
    Unfortunately  more and more shops are choosing to do fudge their dyno results and sell unsuspecting customers into believing they can make far more power than they really do.
     
     The most common practice is to do the final power run in top gear, putting the motor under excessive load for a much longer period of time greatly increasing the chance of failure.  
     This is the one to watch out for and the easiest one to detect, other ways include changing the dyno software config files telling it the drum weight is heavier and fooling it into thinking the bike has more power because it accelerated a a heavier mass drum in a shorter time period or altering the ambient temperature that the dyno sees during the run.
     Fact is the difference between a fourth gear run and a top gear run can be as much as 20 horsepower! If you want to find out the truth there are several quarter mile speed calculators online that you can use for reference then have some fun one day go out to your local dragstrip and have a couple of runs, the black top dyno Never Lies and regardless of your riding ability the terminal speed at the end is an irrefutable indication of your true horsepower. I suspect a few people may be disappointed after putting this to the test and discovering they have been deceived.
     
     When laid bare this is plain dishonesty designed to relieve you of your money based on deception and if you're ok with that you will happily walk away believing that you got what you paid for.
     While I won't make any recommendations good or bad I will go as far as to say it pays to do some due diligence and find a shop that is known to have good integrity and honesty with their customers, I'd rather have 125 real horsepower than 140 imaginary ones  any day of the week. 

    Another little tip if you have had a fresh engine built, then do yourself a favour and  put some run in miles on it before going to Dyno tuning, the tightness, engine sealage, frictional losses and heat generation in a new engine are completely different to an engine that has some miles on it therefore the fuel requirements will change as the motor loosens up after some miles the and the tune-up requirements will also change leaving you with a less than perfect end result.  Hopefully this will help some people when it comes to having a little knowledge about what they can expect from the aftermarket engine and dyno industry; if in doubt there's always that old adage "if it sounds too good to be true..."
  • Jay-Dee
    Jay-Dee
    1 year ago
    Dynos are a tuning tool to basically try and simulate on road/real world load conditions throughout the whole RPM range, nothing more and nothing less.

    With a fresh engine, once the rings are bedded in, change the oil and let it eat. Everything else in the engine runs on a film of oil and really shouldn't "loosen up".
  • brucefxdl
    brucefxdl
    1 year ago
    Quoting sherriff on 28 May 2022 02:45 AM

    For all fellow Harley owners who believe they have huge horsepower after having new engines built and getting them dyno tuned.

     It's sad to say, but the industry in this country is becoming poorly represented by car and motorcycle dyno shops that prey on uninformed people by producing false results to boost their reputations in the public sector in order to lure in more unsuspecting customers.
     Industry standard dyno's for motorcycles when properly calibrated and given correct  atmospheric info are designed to give correct horsepower and torque figures when bikes are run at full throttle in fourth gear when the relationship between engine and rear wheel are at the optimum ratio for for producing these figures accurately.
    Unfortunately  more and more shops are choosing to do fudge their dyno results and sell unsuspecting customers into believing they can make far more power than they really do.
     
     The most common practice is to do the final power run in top gear, putting the motor under excessive load for a much longer period of time greatly increasing the chance of failure.  
     This is the one to watch out for and the easiest one to detect, other ways include changing the dyno software config files telling it the drum weight is heavier and fooling it into thinking the bike has more power because it accelerated a a heavier mass drum in a shorter time period or altering the ambient temperature that the dyno sees during the run.
     Fact is the difference between a fourth gear run and a top gear run can be as much as 20 horsepower! If you want to find out the truth there are several quarter mile speed calculators online that you can use for reference then have some fun one day go out to your local dragstrip and have a couple of runs, the black top dyno Never Lies and regardless of your riding ability the terminal speed at the end is an irrefutable indication of your true horsepower. I suspect a few people may be disappointed after putting this to the test and discovering they have been deceived.
     
     When laid bare this is plain dishonesty designed to relieve you of your money based on deception and if you're ok with that you will happily walk away believing that you got what you paid for.
     While I won't make any recommendations good or bad I will go as far as to say it pays to do some due diligence and find a shop that is known to have good integrity and honesty with their customers, I'd rather have 125 real horsepower than 140 imaginary ones  any day of the week. 

    Another little tip if you have had a fresh engine built, then do yourself a favour and  put some run in miles on it before going to Dyno tuning, the tightness, engine sealage, frictional losses and heat generation in a new engine are completely different to an engine that has some miles on it therefore the fuel requirements will change as the motor loosens up after some miles the and the tune-up requirements will also change leaving you with a less than perfect end result.  Hopefully this will help some people when it comes to having a little knowledge about what they can expect from the aftermarket engine and dyno industry; if in doubt there's always that old adage "if it sounds too good to be true..."

    wow ,great introduction to the forum.....sounded like a church sermon. 
  • OlChesnut
    OlChesnut
    1 year ago
    It pays to be sceptical of anyone in the auto business.  You raise some good points about max horsepower in top gear.  Not much use unless you're drag racing which most don't do.  It's much more useful getting good HP in lower gears.
  • fatbat
    fatbat
    1 year ago
    Welcome to the forum   :o 
  • wadewilson
    wadewilson
    1 year ago
    It is not just the auto industry you have to be careful of. The other night I went into a Bagnio and the employees inside looked nothing like the ones on the poster out front!!!


  • 408
    408
    1 year ago
    One of the skills required with having access to an abundance of info on the net is being able to sort the wheat from the chaff.
    Plenty of chaff in the opening post.
  • robots
    robots
    1 year ago
    Do always see operator fiddling with computer alot

    Thanks Sherrif, poor behaviour, like a hero to some
  • Grease Monkey
    Grease Monkey
    1 year ago
    When you know nothing it's easy to be fooled.
  • steelo
    steelo
    1 year ago
  • paulybronco
    paulybronco
    1 year ago
    Quoting sherriff on 28 May 2022 02:45 AM

    For all fellow Harley owners who believe they have huge horsepower after having new engines built and getting them dyno tuned.

     It's sad to say, but the industry in this country is becoming poorly represented by car and motorcycle dyno shops that prey on uninformed people by producing false results to boost their reputations in the public sector in order to lure in more unsuspecting customers.
     Industry standard dyno's for motorcycles when properly calibrated and given correct  atmospheric info are designed to give correct horsepower and torque figures when bikes are run at full throttle in fourth gear when the relationship between engine and rear wheel are at the optimum ratio for for producing these figures accurately.
    Unfortunately  more and more shops are choosing to do fudge their dyno results and sell unsuspecting customers into believing they can make far more power than they really do.
     
     The most common practice is to do the final power run in top gear, putting the motor under excessive load for a much longer period of time greatly increasing the chance of failure.  
     This is the one to watch out for and the easiest one to detect, other ways include changing the dyno software config files telling it the drum weight is heavier and fooling it into thinking the bike has more power because it accelerated a a heavier mass drum in a shorter time period or altering the ambient temperature that the dyno sees during the run.
     Fact is the difference between a fourth gear run and a top gear run can be as much as 20 horsepower! If you want to find out the truth there are several quarter mile speed calculators online that you can use for reference then have some fun one day go out to your local dragstrip and have a couple of runs, the black top dyno Never Lies and regardless of your riding ability the terminal speed at the end is an irrefutable indication of your true horsepower. I suspect a few people may be disappointed after putting this to the test and discovering they have been deceived.
     
     When laid bare this is plain dishonesty designed to relieve you of your money based on deception and if you're ok with that you will happily walk away believing that you got what you paid for.
     While I won't make any recommendations good or bad I will go as far as to say it pays to do some due diligence and find a shop that is known to have good integrity and honesty with their customers, I'd rather have 125 real horsepower than 140 imaginary ones  any day of the week. 

    Another little tip if you have had a fresh engine built, then do yourself a favour and  put some run in miles on it before going to Dyno tuning, the tightness, engine sealage, frictional losses and heat generation in a new engine are completely different to an engine that has some miles on it therefore the fuel requirements will change as the motor loosens up after some miles the and the tune-up requirements will also change leaving you with a less than perfect end result.  Hopefully this will help some people when it comes to having a little knowledge about what they can expect from the aftermarket engine and dyno industry; if in doubt there's always that old adage "if it sounds too good to be true..."

    Quoting brucefxdl on 28 May 2022 04:01 AM

    wow ,great introduction to the forum.....sounded like a church sermon. 

    Seems like you shot the Sherriff...
  • steelo
    steelo
    1 year ago
    But he did not shoot the deputy
  • robots
    robots
    1 year ago
    Onto them sheriffs 

    Is wrong yeah??