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ABC does it again...

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  • paulybronco
    paulybronco
    3 years ago
    Ha Ha love it.
  • paulybronco
    paulybronco
    3 years ago
    Quoting Wideglider on 07 Nov 2021 11:00 AM

    "The media have a pretty good hit rate here".

    Is this what's it's come to? Never mind the facts - the media slings mud and then some of it sticks?

    Quoting paulybronco on 07 Nov 2021 12:30 PM

    Sounds like a percentage game.....fire a shotgun into the crowd lets see who is wounded approach.

    Quoting FBUser214 on 07 Nov 2021 01:39 PMedited: 07 Nov 2021 08:33 PM


    Don't like my strike rate analogy ?
    You forgotton what you said in your first post?
    'This now seems to be the norm in the media now days where unsubstantiated nonsense is just thrown out there to see what happens...who cares about the truth now days anyway ?'
    You were talking about Louise Milligan ,she re-tweeted a false description of an incident that others had circulated. So one count of unsubstantiated information.
    I still give her 2 out of 3 because of the positive work she did on the other two.
    The media in general, get 3 out of 3 from me here. That is my opinion.
    We are talking about the Court of Public Opinion.
    Not interested in what the Law says, or what the Court says in these cases. They don't always get it right.
    This is a bike forum, not a Court of Law. You expressed an opinion, and I have expressed mine.


    Thankfully the court of public opinion dont get a look in when we move from the pub to the court room. Perhaps the old mythbusters quote "I reject reality and substitute my own" is fitting.
  • FBUser214
    FBUser214
    3 years ago
    Quoting paulybronco on 07 Nov 2021 12:30 PM

    Sounds like a percentage game.....fire a shotgun into the crowd lets see who is wounded approach.

    Quoting FBUser214 on 07 Nov 2021 01:39 PMedited: 07 Nov 2021 08:33 PM


    Don't like my strike rate analogy ?
    You forgotton what you said in your first post?
    'This now seems to be the norm in the media now days where unsubstantiated nonsense is just thrown out there to see what happens...who cares about the truth now days anyway ?'
    You were talking about Louise Milligan ,she re-tweeted a false description of an incident that others had circulated. So one count of unsubstantiated information.
    I still give her 2 out of 3 because of the positive work she did on the other two.
    The media in general, get 3 out of 3 from me here. That is my opinion.
    We are talking about the Court of Public Opinion.
    Not interested in what the Law says, or what the Court says in these cases. They don't always get it right.
    This is a bike forum, not a Court of Law. You expressed an opinion, and I have expressed mine.


    Quoting paulybronco on 07 Nov 2021 11:42 PM

    Thankfully the court of public opinion dont get a look in when we move from the pub to the court room. Perhaps the old mythbusters quote "I reject reality and substitute my own" is fitting.


    Not sure how you would go in a courtroom.
    You reckon the DPP could have another go at Pell ? Look up 'Double Jeopardy".
    And you seem to know fuck all about how a Royal Commission works.
  • paulybronco
    paulybronco
    3 years ago
    Quoting FBUser214 on 07 Nov 2021 01:39 PMedited: 07 Nov 2021 08:33 PM


    Don't like my strike rate analogy ?
    You forgotton what you said in your first post?
    'This now seems to be the norm in the media now days where unsubstantiated nonsense is just thrown out there to see what happens...who cares about the truth now days anyway ?'
    You were talking about Louise Milligan ,she re-tweeted a false description of an incident that others had circulated. So one count of unsubstantiated information.
    I still give her 2 out of 3 because of the positive work she did on the other two.
    The media in general, get 3 out of 3 from me here. That is my opinion.
    We are talking about the Court of Public Opinion.
    Not interested in what the Law says, or what the Court says in these cases. They don't always get it right.
    This is a bike forum, not a Court of Law. You expressed an opinion, and I have expressed mine.


    Quoting paulybronco on 07 Nov 2021 11:42 PM

    Thankfully the court of public opinion dont get a look in when we move from the pub to the court room. Perhaps the old mythbusters quote "I reject reality and substitute my own" is fitting.

    Quoting FBUser214 on 07 Nov 2021 11:59 PMedited: 08 Nov 2021 12:57 AM


    Not sure how you would go in a courtroom.
    You reckon the DPP could have another go at Pell ? Look up 'Double Jeopardy".
    And you seem to know fuck all about how a Royal Commission works.

    I thought you were not interested in what the court said a second ago. 
  • Wideglider
    Wideglider
    3 years ago
    Quoting FBUser214 on 07 Nov 2021 11:45 AM

    'Again i can just repeat myself....the press are there to report the news...NOT make it up. They should be reporting on anything that's in the public interest...but ONLY those pesky FACTS.'
    So, in the Porter case, what did the press make up ?
    At best , he is a liar. And he was the top law person in the country.

    The Royal Commission made adverse findings against Pell. The findings were not released until after his trial.
    At trial he was found guilty by a unanimous verdict of the jury, after hearing all the evidence, of 5 child sexual offences.
    He got off on a technicality on appeal. That does not make him innocent in my book.

    And you have Laming's sanitised version of the photo incident. Did you look any further than that ?
    The store manager saw him taking photos, from behind, unknown to the woman, of the woman bending over , stocking the fridge.
    The manager confronted him and asked to see the photo. The woman and a co-worker saw the photo. The woman and the co-worker said the photo of her bending over, from behind, showing some of her underwear, was inappropriate. The co-worker called him a perv. The manager ensured he deleted the photo before he left.
    The woman made a formal complaint and the co-worker gave supporting evidence. They said she was bending over. Laming's version is the only one which has her kneeling in front of the fridge.
    And this from a Member of Parliament, a Member of our Federal Government ?
    I know which version I believe. But still not a crime.

    I don't think any of these guys pass the pub test. Looks like they pass the pb test.

    And you think the media should not be able to put this stuff before us ?

    And the strike rate ? I reckon they got 3 out of 3.



    Quoting Wideglider on 07 Nov 2021 12:15 PMedited: 07 Nov 2021 12:38 PM

    Strike-rate, strike-rate? Are you an American baseball player?

    Are you attempting some sort of statistical/probability analysis? You conclude that because the particular media that you focus on, has in recent history (a very small sample-size) 'got it right' - means it is ALWAYS right?
    Pub-test? Pub-test before all the facts are heard? OK then, drunken revellers with no access to any facts will solve the world's issues here for you.   

    Quoting FBUser214 on 07 Nov 2021 01:43 PM


    Not interested in your opinion.
    You know as much about this stuff as you do about changing oil.

    Not interested in anyone else's opinion - just your own? Wonder what the concept of a forum is then.

    ? Oil?  What are you talking about?

  • paulybronco
    paulybronco
    3 years ago
    Quoting Wideglider on 07 Nov 2021 12:15 PMedited: 07 Nov 2021 12:38 PM

    Strike-rate, strike-rate? Are you an American baseball player?

    Are you attempting some sort of statistical/probability analysis? You conclude that because the particular media that you focus on, has in recent history (a very small sample-size) 'got it right' - means it is ALWAYS right?
    Pub-test? Pub-test before all the facts are heard? OK then, drunken revellers with no access to any facts will solve the world's issues here for you.   

    Quoting FBUser214 on 07 Nov 2021 01:43 PM


    Not interested in your opinion.
    You know as much about this stuff as you do about changing oil.

    Quoting Wideglider on 08 Nov 2021 09:04 AM

    Not interested in anyone else's opinion - just your own? Wonder what the concept of a forum is then.


    ? Oil?  What are you talking about?

    Perhaps its a case of "I will talk and you will listen"?...LOL
  • Wideglider
    Wideglider
    3 years ago
    Quoting FBUser214 on 07 Nov 2021 01:43 PM


    Not interested in your opinion.
    You know as much about this stuff as you do about changing oil.

    Quoting Wideglider on 08 Nov 2021 09:04 AM

    Not interested in anyone else's opinion - just your own? Wonder what the concept of a forum is then.


    ? Oil?  What are you talking about?

    Quoting paulybronco on 08 Nov 2021 09:20 AM

    Perhaps its a case of "I will talk and you will listen"?...LOL

    I do enjoy a 'robust' discussion - but it has to be a discussion.
  • paulybronco
    paulybronco
    3 years ago
    Quoting Wideglider on 08 Nov 2021 09:04 AM

    Not interested in anyone else's opinion - just your own? Wonder what the concept of a forum is then.


    ? Oil?  What are you talking about?

    Quoting paulybronco on 08 Nov 2021 09:20 AM

    Perhaps its a case of "I will talk and you will listen"?...LOL

    Quoting Wideglider on 08 Nov 2021 11:02 AM

    I do enjoy a 'robust' discussion - but it has to be a discussion.

    Play nicely....lol
  • FBUser214
    FBUser214
    3 years ago
    Quoting paulybronco on 08 Nov 2021 09:20 AM

    Perhaps its a case of "I will talk and you will listen"?...LOL

    Quoting Wideglider on 08 Nov 2021 11:02 AM

    I do enjoy a 'robust' discussion - but it has to be a discussion.

    Quoting paulybronco on 08 Nov 2021 11:29 AM

    Play nicely....lol


    I reckon you two are rootin each other. Typical beamer riders !
  • FBUser214
    FBUser214
    3 years ago
    Quoting paulybronco on 07 Nov 2021 12:30 PM

    Sounds like a percentage game.....fire a shotgun into the crowd lets see who is wounded approach.

    Quoting FBUser214 on 07 Nov 2021 01:39 PMedited: 07 Nov 2021 08:33 PM


    Don't like my strike rate analogy ?
    You forgotton what you said in your first post?
    'This now seems to be the norm in the media now days where unsubstantiated nonsense is just thrown out there to see what happens...who cares about the truth now days anyway ?'
    You were talking about Louise Milligan ,she re-tweeted a false description of an incident that others had circulated. So one count of unsubstantiated information.
    I still give her 2 out of 3 because of the positive work she did on the other two.
    The media in general, get 3 out of 3 from me here. That is my opinion.
    We are talking about the Court of Public Opinion.
    Not interested in what the Law says, or what the Court says in these cases. They don't always get it right.
    This is a bike forum, not a Court of Law. You expressed an opinion, and I have expressed mine.


    Quoting paulybronco on 07 Nov 2021 11:42 PM

    Thankfully the court of public opinion dont get a look in when we move from the pub to the court room. Perhaps the old mythbusters quote "I reject reality and substitute my own" is fitting.


    Pell is living in Vatican City and not Barwon, because the legal system says he is not guilty.
    A lot of people would say he is guilty. More than one meaning. A guilty person becomes innocent on a technicality ?
    You put a topic up, but anybody who doesn't agree with you has their own reality ?

  • paulybronco
    paulybronco
    3 years ago
    Quoting FBUser214 on 07 Nov 2021 01:39 PMedited: 07 Nov 2021 08:33 PM


    Don't like my strike rate analogy ?
    You forgotton what you said in your first post?
    'This now seems to be the norm in the media now days where unsubstantiated nonsense is just thrown out there to see what happens...who cares about the truth now days anyway ?'
    You were talking about Louise Milligan ,she re-tweeted a false description of an incident that others had circulated. So one count of unsubstantiated information.
    I still give her 2 out of 3 because of the positive work she did on the other two.
    The media in general, get 3 out of 3 from me here. That is my opinion.
    We are talking about the Court of Public Opinion.
    Not interested in what the Law says, or what the Court says in these cases. They don't always get it right.
    This is a bike forum, not a Court of Law. You expressed an opinion, and I have expressed mine.


    Quoting paulybronco on 07 Nov 2021 11:42 PM

    Thankfully the court of public opinion dont get a look in when we move from the pub to the court room. Perhaps the old mythbusters quote "I reject reality and substitute my own" is fitting.

    Quoting FBUser214 on 08 Nov 2021 08:13 PMedited: 08 Nov 2021 08:28 PM


    Pell is living in Vatican City and not Barwon, because the legal system says he is not guilty.
    A lot of people would say he is guilty. More than one meaning. A guilty person becomes innocent on a technicality ?
    You put a topic up, but anybody who doesn't agree with you has their own reality ?

    Absolutely not! The quote was a direct reference to your statement "Not interested in what the Law says, or what the Court says in these cases."
    You did say that didn't you...
     
  • FBUser214
    FBUser214
    3 years ago
    Quoting paulybronco on 07 Nov 2021 11:42 PM

    Thankfully the court of public opinion dont get a look in when we move from the pub to the court room. Perhaps the old mythbusters quote "I reject reality and substitute my own" is fitting.

    Quoting FBUser214 on 08 Nov 2021 08:13 PMedited: 08 Nov 2021 08:28 PM


    Pell is living in Vatican City and not Barwon, because the legal system says he is not guilty.
    A lot of people would say he is guilty. More than one meaning. A guilty person becomes innocent on a technicality ?
    You put a topic up, but anybody who doesn't agree with you has their own reality ?

    Quoting paulybronco on 08 Nov 2021 08:45 PM

    Absolutely not! The quote was a direct reference to your statement "Not interested in what the Law says, or what the Court says in these cases."

    You did say that didn't you...
     


    Yes, I did say that. Read it again and see if it sinks in.
    Sometimes the Court gets it wrong and everybody is supposed to go along with it ?
    Did you look up 'Double Jeopardy' to see what it meant ?
    Look up Dierdre Kennedy too !
  • paulybronco
    paulybronco
    3 years ago
    Quoting FBUser214 on 08 Nov 2021 08:13 PMedited: 08 Nov 2021 08:28 PM


    Pell is living in Vatican City and not Barwon, because the legal system says he is not guilty.
    A lot of people would say he is guilty. More than one meaning. A guilty person becomes innocent on a technicality ?
    You put a topic up, but anybody who doesn't agree with you has their own reality ?

    Quoting paulybronco on 08 Nov 2021 08:45 PM

    Absolutely not! The quote was a direct reference to your statement "Not interested in what the Law says, or what the Court says in these cases."

    You did say that didn't you...
     

    Quoting FBUser214 on 08 Nov 2021 08:52 PM


    Yes, I did say that. Read it again and see if it sinks in.
    Sometimes the Court gets it wrong and everybody is supposed to go along with it ?
    Did you look up 'Double Jeopardy' to see what it meant ?
    Look up Dierdre Kennedy too !

    The reality is a resounding "Yes" we do have to accept it! The fantasy is we make our own minds up, perhaps in the pub ;).... and go stone/beat/kick the alleged offender to death. So in this situation do you believe that the mob mentality has a higher success rate in getting it "right" over a court system? 
    You will be constantly disappointed in life if you have a expectation that every court gets every judgement , in your view, correct.
    This is recognized by the system that allows appeals, retrials etc, we have to have faith in those systems or anarchy will prevail.
    Do i like some of the rulings....absolutely not, but trust that the system will pick up the crumbs and do its job, sometimes it just never does. But i dont use my job to fabricate/ hypothesize or slander people that I think may have committed an offence, because surprisingly that is also an offence.
  • FBUser214
    FBUser214
    3 years ago
    Quoting paulybronco on 08 Nov 2021 08:45 PM

    Absolutely not! The quote was a direct reference to your statement "Not interested in what the Law says, or what the Court says in these cases."

    You did say that didn't you...
     

    Quoting FBUser214 on 08 Nov 2021 08:52 PM


    Yes, I did say that. Read it again and see if it sinks in.
    Sometimes the Court gets it wrong and everybody is supposed to go along with it ?
    Did you look up 'Double Jeopardy' to see what it meant ?
    Look up Dierdre Kennedy too !

    Quoting paulybronco on 08 Nov 2021 10:46 PM

    The reality is a resounding "Yes" we do have to accept it! The fantasy is we make our own minds up, perhaps in the pub ;).... and go stone/beat/kick the alleged offender to death. So in this situation do you believe that the mob mentality has a higher success rate in getting it "right" over a court system? 

    You will be constantly disappointed in life if you have a expectation that every court gets every judgement , in your view, correct.
    This is recognized by the system that allows appeals, retrials etc, we have to have faith in those systems or anarchy will prevail.
    Do i like some of the rulings....absolutely not, but trust that the system will pick up the crumbs and do its job, sometimes it just never does. But i dont use my job to fabricate/ hypothesize or slander people that I think may have committed an offence, because surprisingly that is also an offence.


    I don't know where you get this shit from.
    I expressed a personal view in reply to your posts. I am not going into the street as part of a mob.
    I am not going to be constantly disappointed in life, I understand how things work.
    The word 'guilty' has many meanings not just the legal definition, you don't seem to get that.
    And Louise Milligan on this occasion was found to have defamed Laming and a penalty was imposed.
    She posted the tweet on her private account, out of normal work hours, so it was not done as part of her job.
    Maybe she should have paid, rather than the ABC .  2 out of 3, like I said.

  • fatbat
    fatbat
    3 years ago
    Courts don’t find people innocent. They’re found not-guilty. There’s a reason why those words are used. 

    At least we can all agree on the sentiment about bmw riders 
  • paulybronco
    paulybronco
    3 years ago
    Quoting fatbat on 09 Nov 2021 01:31 AMedited: 09 Nov 2021 06:01 AM

    Courts don’t find people innocent. They’re found not-guilty. There’s a reason why those words are used. 


    At least we can all agree on the sentiment about bmw riders 

    Ha Ha just back from riding it....even stayed on it today!
  • GGUser260
    GGUser260
    3 years ago
    Quoting fatbat on 09 Nov 2021 01:31 AMedited: 09 Nov 2021 06:01 AM

    Courts don’t find people innocent. They’re found not-guilty. There’s a reason why those words are used. 


    At least we can all agree on the sentiment about bmw riders 

    we're not just gunna let you walk outta here?
    Who is "we" sucker?
    Smith, Wesson & me.
  • FBUser214
    FBUser214
    3 years ago
    pinkjames.jpg
  • GGUser260
    GGUser260
    3 years ago
    Quoting fatbat on 09 Nov 2021 01:31 AMedited: 09 Nov 2021 06:01 AM

    Courts don’t find people innocent. They’re found not-guilty. There’s a reason why those words are used. 


    At least we can all agree on the sentiment about bmw riders 

    The criminal legal process is not a quest for the truth.
    The question for the  jury as triers of the facts is: "has the prosecution proved each element of the count Presented beyond reasonable doubt?"
    In a trial ,the jury can only render its verdict on the evidence before it. If you want the full picture ,be wary of media reports from people who have not observed the entirety of the evidence. Courts do make errors ,but for the great majority of cases they get it right-unfortunately such routine and  correct decisions rarely reach the media or public domain. Finally, I would welcome the critics  to explain their alternative model of how to get things right far more often and effectively than the existing legal system? Bear in mind to do so, you can't operate on the assumption that the "Accused" is always an obvious "scumbag." You will need to factor in  your belief/trust in  your new model  as it deals with any and all Accused- especially if that Accused is you or someone very dear to you.      
    a02e1868430725.Y3JvcCw4MjcsNjQ3LDE0OSww_1.jpg
    Caviar anyone?
  • paulybronco
    paulybronco
    3 years ago
    Quoting fatbat on 09 Nov 2021 01:31 AMedited: 09 Nov 2021 06:01 AM

    Courts don’t find people innocent. They’re found not-guilty. There’s a reason why those words are used. 


    At least we can all agree on the sentiment about bmw riders 

    Quoting GGUser260 on 10 Nov 2021 10:19 AM

    The criminal legal process is not a quest for the truth.

    The question for the  jury as triers of the facts is: "has the prosecution proved each element of the count Presented beyond reasonable doubt?"
    In a trial ,the jury can only render its verdict on the evidence before it. If you want the full picture ,be wary of media reports from people who have not observed the entirety of the evidence. Courts do make errors ,but for the great majority of cases they get it right-unfortunately such routine and  correct decisions rarely reach the media or public domain. Finally, I would welcome the critics  to explain their alternative model of how to get things right far more often and effectively than the existing legal system? Bear in mind to do so, you can't operate on the assumption that the "Accused" is always an obvious "scumbag." You will need to factor in  your belief/trust in  your new model  as it deals with any and all Accused- especially if that Accused is you or someone very dear to you.      

    a02e1868430725.Y3JvcCw4MjcsNjQ3LDE0OSww_1.jpg
    Caviar anyone?
    And that GG is the best post of the topic.
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