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  • Jeffa
    Jeffa
    3 years ago
    Hi guys just asking fir done ideas please I have a 03 vrod 100th Anniversary edition. Before I had a mechanic install a thundermax on my bike I was getting 230klm on the trip meter before I hit the reserve light  now with the thundermax I get 140klm on the trip meter before the reserve light comes on... I don't think that's Normal any advice please.
    If u like you can email me back on jeffa01@live.com.au 
    As I may not check this forum that often 
  • tussuck
    tussuck
    3 years ago
    Well your right... thats not normal.  Nor is joining the forum with a question and then asking us to contact you via email - which is really sus!

    if your not bothered to pop back in then why should folks be bothered to answer them.

  • paulybronco
    paulybronco
    3 years ago
    Quoting tussuck on 26 Sep 2021 11:14 AM

    Well your right... thats not normal.  Nor is joining the forum with a question and then asking us to contact you via email - which is really sus!


    if your not bothered to pop back in then why should folks be bothered to answer them.

    Fuck me we seem to be able to attract some strange posts.
  • Retroman
    Retroman
    3 years ago
    Thundermax ALWAYS ruins the fuel consumption.

    A noted tuner in the USA , goes by the name of "Shovelhead Bob" once posted , 

    "a Thundermax tuned bike may pass most bikes but cannot pass a gas station"..

    Now that quote is from over 10 years ago but the sentiment still stands.

    I have removed several over the years as they expire electronically and put the stock ECM and O2 sensors back into the bikes concerned.
  • tussuck
    tussuck
    3 years ago
    My Tmax ROCKS!  21km/L since installed well over 5 years ago.  I tweak it once in a while for chits and giggles, but the wideband autotune just keeps on rolling.

  • Daffy
    Daffy
    3 years ago
    Quoting Jeffa on 26 Sep 2021 09:54 AMedited: 26 Sep 2021 09:07 AM

    Hi guys just asking fir done ideas please I have a 03 vrod 100th Anniversary edition. Before I had a mechanic install a thundermax on my bike I was getting 230klm on the trip meter before I hit the reserve light  now with the thundermax I get 140klm on the trip meter before the reserve light comes on... I don't think that's Normal any advice please.

    If u like you can email me back on jeffa01@live.com.au 
    As I may not check this forum that often 

    Something is wrong with the installation. Does it have auto tune?My fuel economy was better with the Thundermax.Best thing I ever did to my Deluxe.
  • Daffy
    Daffy
    3 years ago
    Quoting Retroman on 27 Sep 2021 08:16 AM

    Thundermax ALWAYS ruins the fuel consumption.


    A noted tuner in the USA , goes by the name of "Shovelhead Bob" once posted , 

    "a Thundermax tuned bike may pass most bikes but cannot pass a gas station"..

    Now that quote is from over 10 years ago but the sentiment still stands.

    I have removed several over the years as they expire electronically and put the stock ECM and O2 sensors back into the bikes concerned.

    Certainly wasn’t my experience 
  • Grease Monkey
    Grease Monkey
    3 years ago
    My son in law had a tmax on his bike, went to sell it at the Harley shop and they didn't want it, something to keep in mind anyway, plenty are happy with them but the best you know is the best you've had as they say, the Delphi ECM tuned properly is a very capable unit, btw, no such thing as Auto tune, doesn't do what you think it does, sales gimmick.
  • Wideglider
    Wideglider
    3 years ago
    Quoting Grease Monkey on 28 Sep 2021 09:05 AM

    My son in law had a tmax on his bike, went to sell it at the Harley shop and they didn't want it, something to keep in mind anyway, plenty are happy with them but the best you know is the best you've had as they say, the Delphi ECM tuned properly is a very capable unit, btw, no such thing as Auto tune, doesn't do what you think it does, sales gimmick.

    btw, no such thing as Auto tune, doesn't do what you think it does, sales gimmick.
    Am interested - can you elaborate on this statement?
  • Retroman
    Retroman
    3 years ago
    It was NOT my intention to slag off the Thundermax system. I just gave my considered opinion from long experience.

    I can see why an HD dealer would baulk at taking a used bike into stock so equipped. They would want the stock ECM I am sure.

    They would have spotted it on a workshop pre-purchase check.

    Three years ago I was asked to "service and tune" a fairly nice looking Nightrain , brought used from NZ as a "personal import" , (not via the RAWS system) , then resold privately here in WA.

    Bike arrives , is duly 3 hole oil changed etc etc and when I whip the seat go to hook up the ECM to my laptop by fuck it's a T-max ECM.

    Guy had been complaining of "rough running" and black smoke on wide open throttle. Nothing I could do for him , stock ECM long gone..

    I would doubt if anyone in WA could have helped him at that time , and I was sorry I couldn't.

    Frasers quote to refit a new Delphi ECM , marry it to the TSSM etc , was well painful. The T-Max had been around a grand when first put into the bike !

    Moral of the story here , the stock ECM should at the very least stay with the bike on it's life's journey , not for if but for when ! 
  • tussuck
    tussuck
    3 years ago
    Quoting Grease Monkey on 28 Sep 2021 09:05 AM

    My son in law had a tmax on his bike, went to sell it at the Harley shop and they didn't want it, something to keep in mind anyway, plenty are happy with them but the best you know is the best you've had as they say, the Delphi ECM tuned properly is a very capable unit, btw, no such thing as Auto tune, doesn't do what you think it does, sales gimmick.

    Bollocks!  The autotune function on the Tmax is bloody awesome.  It comes with the wideband O2 sensors (stock harley ones are narrowband on/off units) and the smarts to adjust fuel ratio to get to a mapped outcome.
  • tussuck
    tussuck
    3 years ago
    Quoting Retroman on 28 Sep 2021 11:27 AMedited: 28 Sep 2021 11:40 AM

    It was NOT my intention to slag off the Thundermax system. I just gave my considered opinion from long experience.


    I can see why an HD dealer would baulk at taking a used bike into stock so equipped. They would want the stock ECM I am sure.

    They would have spotted it on a workshop pre-purchase check.

    Three years ago I was asked to "service and tune" a fairly nice looking Nightrain , brought used from NZ as a "personal import" , (not via the RAWS system) , then resold privately here in WA.

    Bike arrives , is duly 3 hole oil changed etc etc and when I whip the seat go to hook up the ECM to my laptop by fuck it's a T-max ECM.

    Guy had been complaining of "rough running" and black smoke on wide open throttle. Nothing I could do for him , stock ECM long gone..

    I would doubt if anyone in WA could have helped him at that time , and I was sorry I couldn't.

    Frasers quote to refit a new Delphi ECM , marry it to the TSSM etc , was well painful. The T-Max had been around a grand when first put into the bike !

    Moral of the story here , the stock ECM should at the very least stay with the bike on it's life's journey , not for if but for when ! 

    Agree, I still have my stock ECU in a box somewhere.  But if I was to sell then the Tmax goes with the bike + the software with maps + the cables.
  • Smokey61
    Smokey61
    3 years ago
    Quoting Retroman on 28 Sep 2021 11:27 AMedited: 28 Sep 2021 11:40 AM

    It was NOT my intention to slag off the Thundermax system. I just gave my considered opinion from long experience.


    I can see why an HD dealer would baulk at taking a used bike into stock so equipped. They would want the stock ECM I am sure.

    They would have spotted it on a workshop pre-purchase check.

    Three years ago I was asked to "service and tune" a fairly nice looking Nightrain , brought used from NZ as a "personal import" , (not via the RAWS system) , then resold privately here in WA.

    Bike arrives , is duly 3 hole oil changed etc etc and when I whip the seat go to hook up the ECM to my laptop by fuck it's a T-max ECM.

    Guy had been complaining of "rough running" and black smoke on wide open throttle. Nothing I could do for him , stock ECM long gone..

    I would doubt if anyone in WA could have helped him at that time , and I was sorry I couldn't.

    Frasers quote to refit a new Delphi ECM , marry it to the TSSM etc , was well painful. The T-Max had been around a grand when first put into the bike !

    Moral of the story here , the stock ECM should at the very least stay with the bike on it's life's journey , not for if but for when ! 

    Mine had a Thundermax when I bought it. Got the stock ECU with it. Used to ping like a bastard on sudden handfuls of throttle. Thought Autotune was supposed to sort that shit out. Guy that fitted and tuned it retired shortly after I bought the bike and the HD dealer were all Sgt. Schultz on it.

    Old mate, over a beer or eight, talked me into upgrading cams and chucked me an unmarried SE STP tuner, fitted all that and had the dealer dyno tune it. Love the power on tap now. No more pinging.
  • FBUser214
    FBUser214
    3 years ago
    Quoting Grease Monkey on 28 Sep 2021 09:05 AM

    My son in law had a tmax on his bike, went to sell it at the Harley shop and they didn't want it, something to keep in mind anyway, plenty are happy with them but the best you know is the best you've had as they say, the Delphi ECM tuned properly is a very capable unit, btw, no such thing as Auto tune, doesn't do what you think it does, sales gimmick.

    Quoting tussuck on 28 Sep 2021 12:36 PM

    Bollocks!  The autotune function on the Tmax is bloody awesome.  It comes with the wideband O2 sensors (stock harley ones are narrowband on/off units) and the smarts to adjust fuel ratio to get to a mapped outcome.


    So, tell me how it autotunes the timing.
  • tussuck
    tussuck
    3 years ago
    That's not its job...It tunes AFR (thats like asking 'but does it check tyre pressure').  Yeah timing is nice BUT AFR is the ticket.
  • markwoumla
    markwoumla
    3 years ago
    This thread may get a robust discussion happening on the pros and cons of auto tuning etc , like the good old days !!!!!
    Will keep tuned in for the fire works !!!!
  • keith
    keith
    3 years ago
    Quoting markwoumla on 28 Sep 2021 11:36 PM

    This thread may get a robust discussion happening on the pros and cons of auto tuning etc , like the good old days !!!!!

    Will keep tuned in for the fire works !!!!

    You're out of the retirement village ? Agreed good discussion.
  • Krash Kinkade
    Krash Kinkade
    3 years ago
    I'm still on a Carb .
    Just reading this , have known about Thundermax for ages from people with EFI Harleys looking for magic, posting on American forums.
    I'm sure someone has tested before & after on a Dyno & checked afr fuel curve under full load. if I had a problem thats what I'd do. there is a few systems that you can hook up to a sensor ( need to drill & weld a bung into your pipe ) then find a big hill on a quite road. put motor under full load, then plug into lap top & check the afr fuel curve. I've got one of these systems laying around here somewhere.
    I'm  puzzled , as this guy goes to a workshop, pays to get a Thundermax fitted. then comes in here to cry his fuel economy has dropped off. But he did not mention if his bike ran harder or if it was slower, all he was interested in was fuel economy?
  • Hoodeng
    Hoodeng
    3 years ago
    It tunes the timing by looking for dets.

    Auto tune systems only write tunes for areas that they have been taken to, so if you ride your bike and don't take it over 3.5k the map after 3.5k is a default until it gathers enough relevant data to re write the map. As has been found in the past this can be detrimental to the engine is some instances as the default could have an ignition map or fuel map not suitable for the engine in question.
  • FBUser214
    FBUser214
    3 years ago
    Quoting tussuck on 28 Sep 2021 10:12 PM

    That's not its job...It tunes AFR (thats like asking 'but does it check tyre pressure').  Yeah timing is nice BUT AFR is the ticket.

    Tyre pressure doesn't make any difference to how well your engine runs, it may make a difference to how well the bike rolls down the road and takes the corners.
    Timing or spark advance is a critical part of tuning, a tune doesn't mean just having the right AFR.
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