Online: evo94
  • leachy
    leachy
    3 days ago
    I need a half decent lawyer. I have a disagreement with Services NSW and the use of a mobile phone and a mobile, mobile phone detection camera. Now my car has apple car play and android auto and the phone is plugged in, I believe its sitting flat face up in the centre, almost impossible to tell from the pics. I drove past this three day and its booked my three times and apparently this isnt allowed to be used / sitting like this. 

    So Im looking for some in the Western Sydney area, can anyone recommend someone who doesn't cost the earth, happen to be going through a divorce at the same time.

    Regards
    Leachy  
  • steelo
    steelo
    3 days ago
    Sorry to hear leachy. 
  • leachy
    leachy
    3 days ago
    That's life I guess.
  • STEAMER
    STEAMER
    3 days ago
    Same as cant be sitting on your lap or near it as they say you could touch it at any time.
  • beaglebasher
    beaglebasher
    3 days ago
    I leave my phone flat, face up in the centre consul when I am driving. 
    Is that not allowed?
  • leachy
    leachy
    3 days ago
    Quoting beaglebasher on 20 Jul 2021 05:35 AM

    I leave my phone flat, face up in the centre consul when I am driving. 

    Is that not allowed?

    Well apparently it depends if your hand or leg can be near it or touch it in anyway. Not allowed to hand it to a passenger or have a passenger in the front seat watching YouTube. However if you have it attached to the windscreen of you car in a cradle its all good, obviously not watching YouTube. The only way you can touch your phone in the drivers seat is with the engine turned off.
  • fatbat
    fatbat
    3 days ago
    Quoting leachy on 20 Jul 2021 12:42 AM

    I need a half decent lawyer. I have a disagreement with Services NSW and the use of a mobile phone and a mobile, mobile phone detection camera. Now my car has apple car play and android auto and the phone is plugged in, I believe its sitting flat face up in the centre, almost impossible to tell from the pics. I drove past this three day and its booked my three times and apparently this isnt allowed to be used / sitting like this. 


    So Im looking for some in the Western Sydney area, can anyone recommend someone who doesn't cost the earth, happen to be going through a divorce at the same time.

    Regards
    Leachy  

    Two issues to look into before engaging a lawyer 

    1) Is it obvious that it’s your phone and not some other object? If taken to court the prosecution is obviously required to prove all elements of the offence beyond reasonable doubt. They need to prove it’s a phone and also need to prove you were operating or using it. More on that below…..

    2) the infringement notice should have the offence including the section and act. Look up the offence and have a read including the terms use or operate that’ll likely be defined in the same act. Operate or use mobile telephone have traditionally required more than a phone sitting at arms length or on the centre console. Look it up and then work out if it’s worth having a fight or not. And whether or not you need a lawyer for the fight. If things have changed since when I was last across this stuff, then it’s a big shift. 

    All the easy to find stuff on Google from the rta says you’ve gotta use a cradle. It also says you can’t use your hands or lap. But it’s silent on having it in or in the centre console etc 

    Good luck. That’s pretty farked 

    I hate cameras for this reason. Do something innocent without knowing you’re doing something wrong and you don’t find out until a month later when you get three tickets for the same conduct. That’s not really road safety is it as you don’t remedy the supposed unsafe behaviour until a month later after you’ve already repeated it twice. A reasonable cop would either let you off but even if they booked you, you’d know where you stood and wouldnt make the same mistake again 
  • leachy
    leachy
    3 days ago
    Quoting leachy on 20 Jul 2021 12:42 AM

    I need a half decent lawyer. I have a disagreement with Services NSW and the use of a mobile phone and a mobile, mobile phone detection camera. Now my car has apple car play and android auto and the phone is plugged in, I believe its sitting flat face up in the centre, almost impossible to tell from the pics. I drove past this three day and its booked my three times and apparently this isnt allowed to be used / sitting like this. 


    So Im looking for some in the Western Sydney area, can anyone recommend someone who doesn't cost the earth, happen to be going through a divorce at the same time.

    Regards
    Leachy  

    Quoting fatbat on 20 Jul 2021 06:26 AMedited: 20 Jul 2021 06:36 AM

    Two issues to look into before engaging a lawyer 


    1) Is it obvious that it’s your phone and not some other object? If taken to court the prosecution is obviously required to prove all elements of the offence beyond reasonable doubt. They need to prove it’s a phone and also need to prove you were operating or using it. More on that below…..

    2) the infringement notice should have the offence including the section and act. Look up the offence and have a read including the terms use or operate that’ll likely be defined in the same act. Operate or use mobile telephone have traditionally required more than a phone sitting at arms length or on the centre console. Look it up and then work out if it’s worth having a fight or not. And whether or not you need a lawyer for the fight. If things have changed since when I was last across this stuff, then it’s a big shift. 

    All the easy to find stuff on Google from the rta says you’ve gotta use a cradle. It also says you can’t use your hands or lap. But it’s silent on having it in or in the centre console etc 

    Good luck. That’s pretty farked 

    I hate cameras for this reason. Do something innocent without knowing you’re doing something wrong and you don’t find out until a month later when you get three tickets for the same conduct. That’s not really road safety is it as you don’t remedy the supposed unsafe behaviour until a month later after you’ve already repeated it twice. A reasonable cop would either let you off but even if they booked you, you’d know where you stood and wouldnt make the same mistake again 

    Seems that the best/cheapest option is to pay and hopefully apply for a good behavior period, oh well my fault thats the rules. 
  • Carizo
    Carizo
    3 days ago
    Hi Leachy

    Without revealing too much of my past, FB's advice is good advice. You may not have the energy to follow his advice with a divorce going on at the moment which I can understand but it may be worth your while. If your research reveals that you may not have committed the traffic infringement, then write to the address on the back of the ticket (used to be the Infringement Processing Unit or something like that in Parramatta - but that was many years ago) politely explaining your circumstances (give them all of the facts and if you have a good driving record - state the number of years you've been driving - then tell them so) and ask them to review the issue of the tickets / notices and or deal with them by way of a caution. It'll cost you some time and a stamp but you might save you a lot more.

    Ultimately it's your decision. Best of luck.

    Cheers Carizo.
  • paulybronco
    paulybronco
    3 days ago
    Quoting beaglebasher on 20 Jul 2021 05:35 AM

    I leave my phone flat, face up in the centre consul when I am driving. 

    Is that not allowed?

    Quoting leachy on 20 Jul 2021 05:47 AMedited: 20 Jul 2021 05:49 AM

    Well apparently it depends if your hand or leg can be near it or touch it in anyway. Not allowed to hand it to a passenger or have a passenger in the front seat watching YouTube. However if you have it attached to the windscreen of you car in a cradle its all good, obviously not watching YouTube. The only way you can touch your phone in the drivers seat is with the engine turned off.

    The only way you can touch your phone in the drivers seat is with the engine turned off.

    And thats no entirely true either, you're deemed to be in control of a motor vehicle if the keys are in the ignition....on or off!
  • Ratbob
    Ratbob
    3 days ago
    Quoting beaglebasher on 20 Jul 2021 05:35 AM

    I leave my phone flat, face up in the centre consul when I am driving. 

    Is that not allowed?

    Quoting leachy on 20 Jul 2021 05:47 AMedited: 20 Jul 2021 05:49 AM

    Well apparently it depends if your hand or leg can be near it or touch it in anyway. Not allowed to hand it to a passenger or have a passenger in the front seat watching YouTube. However if you have it attached to the windscreen of you car in a cradle its all good, obviously not watching YouTube. The only way you can touch your phone in the drivers seat is with the engine turned off.

    Quoting paulybronco on 20 Jul 2021 09:04 AM

    The only way you can touch your phone in the drivers seat is with the engine turned off.

    And thats no entirely true either, you're deemed to be in control of a motor vehicle if the keys are in the ignition....on or off!

    I wonder how that applies to cars that just run a proximity fob ?  Guess you have to press the Start button to turn it off, not that you’d tell in a hybrid/electric.
    The law is an ass.
  • Smokey61
    Smokey61
    3 days ago
    Quoting beaglebasher on 20 Jul 2021 05:35 AM

    I leave my phone flat, face up in the centre consul when I am driving. 

    Is that not allowed?

    Quoting leachy on 20 Jul 2021 05:47 AMedited: 20 Jul 2021 05:49 AM

    Well apparently it depends if your hand or leg can be near it or touch it in anyway. Not allowed to hand it to a passenger or have a passenger in the front seat watching YouTube. However if you have it attached to the windscreen of you car in a cradle its all good, obviously not watching YouTube. The only way you can touch your phone in the drivers seat is with the engine turned off.

    Quoting paulybronco on 20 Jul 2021 09:04 AM

    The only way you can touch your phone in the drivers seat is with the engine turned off.

    And thats no entirely true either, you're deemed to be in control of a motor vehicle if the keys are in the ignition....on or off!

    That pertains to drunks. You are allowed to use your phone if you're parked with the engine off and the park brake on.
  • Far Canal
    Far Canal
    2 days ago
    You can be drunk in your car while driving it, while talking on your phone and sticking your fingers up at the cops, if you are on your own property.

    If I was you Leachy, I would try to get off the fine if you think you were doing nothing wrong. A well written letter can do marvelous things. If you are up to it that is, a divorce would be a morale killer.
  • steelo
    steelo
    2 days ago
    As a parting gift. Nominate her as the driver
  • leachy
    leachy
    2 days ago
    Quoting steelo on 21 Jul 2021 01:00 AM

    As a parting gift. Nominate her as the driver

    LOL, we don't hate each other and she is more than happy for me to keep my three bikes.


  • Soapbox2627
    Soapbox2627
    2 days ago
    Quoting steelo on 21 Jul 2021 01:00 AM

    As a parting gift. Nominate her as the driver

    Quoting leachy on 21 Jul 2021 01:10 AM

    LOL, we don't hate each other and she is more than happy for me to keep my three bikes.



    no point keeping the 3 bikes with no license, give Steelo's option a thought
  • leachy
    leachy
    yesterday
    Quoting steelo on 21 Jul 2021 01:00 AM

    As a parting gift. Nominate her as the driver

    Quoting leachy on 21 Jul 2021 01:10 AM

    LOL, we don't hate each other and she is more than happy for me to keep my three bikes.



    Quoting Soapbox2627 on 21 Jul 2021 07:44 AM

    no point keeping the 3 bikes with no license, give Steelo's option a thought

    It would only be for 3 months and it seems like we will be in lockdown for most of it anyway.
  • magnum54
    magnum54
    yesterday
    Write a letter protesting your innocence and stating the circumstances.
    Might help if you had a statement from your service provider showing no incoming or outgoing calls or texts at the time.
    Tell them you are prepared to defend it in Court.
    See what their response is.
  • steelo
    steelo
    yesterday
    Leachy. Have you gone online and viewed the camera photos. Get or download copies. That's a good place to start. If you wish, PM me your email address and I can send you some draft word documents I have used for parking and speeding offences. You can edit them to suit.
    I've been online and it appears NSW legislation gives limited avenues for appeal but there are some. It may be that you wear one, and ask to be cautioned on the others.
    Hope to hear from you.