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M8 Low Rider 124ci 475 cam Skids off the line?

  • GGUser122
    GGUser122
    3 years ago
    Hi all,
    I recently installed a s&s 124 ci big bore kit and a 475 s&s cam but was underwhelmed by the power and torque.
    Initially with a canned map for run in, it had a huge surge of power after 2300 (you had to hold on) but was a pig to ride anywhere under these revs. Always searching and very loud and rich.
    When i ran it in, i took it back to Harley Heaven for the dyno and now its a lot smoother at lower revs but feels like its lost power.
    The dyno sheet says 121hp and 132fp with 120fp flat all the way up to 3500rpm but picking up the highest torque (132fp)between 3500-4500 revs
    I would have thought that i should be able to break traction off takeoff without dumping the clutch but i could be wrong.
    What are your riding experiences with this setup?
    Should i be going sideways down the street or are my expectations too high?
    I have a feeling i may need to dyno it else where
  • Krash Kinkade
    Krash Kinkade
    3 years ago
    Quoting GGUser122 on 01 Jan 2021 09:40 PM

    Hi all,

    I recently installed a s&s 124 ci big bore kit and a 475 s&s cam but was underwhelmed by the power and torque.
    Initially with a canned map for run in, it had a huge surge of power after 2300 (you had to hold on) but was a pig to ride anywhere under these revs. Always searching and very loud and rich.
    When i ran it in, i took it back to Harley Heaven for the dyno and now its a lot smoother at lower revs but feels like its lost power.
    The dyno sheet says 121hp and 132fp with 120fp flat all the way up to 3500rpm but picking up the highest torque (132fp)between 3500-4500 revs
    I would have thought that i should be able to break traction off takeoff without dumping the clutch but i could be wrong.
    What are your riding experiences with this setup?
    Should i be going sideways down the street or are my expectations too high?
    I have a feeling i may need to dyno it else where

    GG , sorry to read!
    can understand how you feel, just having power & Torque numbers @ rpm, does not tell the same story as, Having Power & Torque numbers @ how many seconds it took under full load wide open, I like to see a  timed dyno printout as well, & ask the operator to go for the tune that makes the most HP & TQ the quickest! in most cases the numbers might be a bit lower, but when you ride it you will feel it!! like Rev per minute, just tell's me how many rev's motor was at, not how long it took to get to that rev. hope you understand my meaning.
  • Grease Monkey
    Grease Monkey
    3 years ago
    Damage done you thinking 54?
    Was one of my thoughts as well if so, also who at HH tuned it? Dealership tunes are not always that great, no disrespect intended just my observation over the years.

  • fatbat
    fatbat
    3 years ago
    I’m of the same view as Magnum and Monkey. 
    Plus what was installed as part of the kit?

    Admittedly I’ve never ridden a 124ci harley but my expectations are the same as yours, especially in a lighter-weight non-tourer bike. Ie break traction, front wheel lifting and hold on tight. That’s how my 117ci dyna feels. 
  • GGUser122
    GGUser122
    3 years ago
    Yes, 1000km run in actually 
  • GGUser122
    GGUser122
    3 years ago
    Quoting Grease Monkey on 02 Jan 2021 12:22 AM

    Damage done you thinking 54?

    Was one of my thoughts as well if so, also who at HH tuned it? Dealership tunes are not always that great, no disrespect intended just my observation over the years.

    What do you mean by damage is done?
    It was run in for 1000km.
    I agree, from what iv heard it takes 4-5 hours to do a custom tune, so im willing to pay for another tune else where.
    Do you recommend anyone?
  • GGUser122
    GGUser122
    3 years ago
    Quoting fatbat on 02 Jan 2021 01:20 AMedited: 04 Jan 2021 01:47 AM

    I’m of the same view as Magnum and Monkey. 

    Plus what was installed as part of the kit?

    Admittedly I’ve never ridden a 124ci harley but my expectations are the same as yours, especially in a lighter-weight non-tourer bike. Ie break traction, front wheel lifting and hold on tight. That’s how my 117ci dyna feels. 

    Yep thats what i was expecting.
    I did the 124ci kit with 475c cam
    Adjustable pushrods
    Tappets
    Tappet cuffs
    Cam plate and oil pump (s&s)
    Heavy duty clutch springs
    5.5 injectors
    55mm SE intake manifold

    The bike already had a 
    Bassani road rage 3
    S&S air cleaner
    Techno research maximus computer  

  • GGUser122
    GGUser122
    3 years ago
    I forgot to mention the bike vibrates a heap during 3-4000 rpm and worse during deceleration, not sure if this is normal.
    Here is the dyno sheets i was given.
    The original “before” had 78.38hp and 99 torque
    The final before and after dyno sheet says i had 75.02hp and 94.43 torque.
    The figures just dont match up which worries me.
    075931FE-6EEB-47A4-82A7-B1ABF237DB91.jpeg
    This is before and after
    A5428F2D-7EC5-4CAC-881F-CDF1980CE4AA.jpeg
    This was canned map to custom tune
    019F6BE0-30C8-4AF9-B3AD-5F8ACF7D0171.jpeg
    This was supposed to be stock when i bought it in
  • steelo
    steelo
    3 years ago
    I feel very sorry for you fellas that get caught up with this bike upgrade scam.
    Every man and his dog (well not me) is spruiking their performance wares and tuning skills with the specific purpose of separating you from your hard earned money.
    This forum is littered with stories of members who have been royally rooted over. (and that's only the ones that will admit it or bother to come onto a forum)
    Almost every week there's a new one. Usually without any introduction. Telling us what a great deal / performance upgrade they just bought followed by the inevitable tale of woe and a list of parts and things tried.
    What is sad, is that most members have no confidence in most cases of going back to the original store, mechanic or tuner for advice or resolution and have to ask the forum whether the poor result they were dished up or left with is the norm.
    Because the bikes have been fundamentally changed mechanically and complex electronics screwed with, the company can quite legitimately wash their hands of the whole matter as the bike is no longer standard. I don't imagine many statutory bodies are prepared to go into bat because of that. Am I being unfair..
  • fatbat
    fatbat
    3 years ago
    GGUser122
    Where are you located?
  • Grease Monkey
    Grease Monkey
    3 years ago
    Steelo I understand what a lot of blokes are doing, some not so much, some unscrupulous businesses take money for shit work its true, other times it's the customer who insists on some plan and a shop just does what they want the best they can, I don't see the whole industry as a scam but I do see it as caveat emptor, have a plan, shop around, ask questions.
  • GGUser122
    GGUser122
    3 years ago
    Quoting fatbat on 02 Jan 2021 10:54 AM

    GGUser122

    Where are you located?

    Melbourne.
    Iv been told to look at Maztech and EBT Performance for a good Dyno workshop
  • Krash Kinkade
    Krash Kinkade
    3 years ago
    Quoting fatbat on 02 Jan 2021 10:54 AM

    GGUser122

    Where are you located?

    Quoting GGUser122 on 02 Jan 2021 02:39 PM

    Melbourne.

    Iv been told to look at Maztech and EBT Performance for a good Dyno workshop

    Brian @ Eastern Big Twins , Good!

    Just read steel's post, I don't worry, but if I can I try to give helpful advice.

    I would not go to a dealer for performance work, they just sell new bikes, so not really experience with performance upgrades.

    All your motor needs is a tune by an experienced operator . If it was mine I would take it to EBT. good luck!
  • Ratbob
    Ratbob
    3 years ago
    Quoting GGUser122 on 02 Jan 2021 10:13 AM

    I forgot to mention the bike vibrates a heap during 3-4000 rpm and worse during deceleration, not sure if this is normal.

    Here is the dyno sheets i was given.
    The original “before” had 78.38hp and 99 torque
    The final before and after dyno sheet says i had 75.02hp and 94.43 torque.
    The figures just dont match up which worries me.

    075931FE-6EEB-47A4-82A7-B1ABF237DB91.jpeg
    This is before and after
    A5428F2D-7EC5-4CAC-881F-CDF1980CE4AA.jpeg
    This was canned map to custom tune
    019F6BE0-30C8-4AF9-B3AD-5F8ACF7D0171.jpeg
    This was supposed to be stock when i bought it in
    On the Dyno figures I wouldn't be worried.
    The after numbers, which are the ones of interest, because that's how your bike is now, are consistent.
    It seems the custom tune just took out the circa 4k dip.

    On the vibration, yeah, I've noticed it.  When the M8s came out I was keen on the new Fatboy, took a test ride and man it really vibrated almost shuddered between 3 and 4k.  Hated it, especially when they were touting it as being a smooth ride and man the gearbox was clunky.
    Later I tried a Breakout, same thing and as you said, worse on decel.

    Not so evident on my test of a Street Glide but as I lost interest I didn't follow it up, are they still rubberglides ?
  • fatbat
    fatbat
    3 years ago
    Brian at EBT used to be a forum sponsor and is highly regarded for working on and tuning harleys. That’s all he does, he’s done it for many years and he has a motorcycle dyno. That’s who I was gonna recommend if you were in Melbourne.  Maztech has a dyno and whilst people say the fella there is good at tuning, he doesn’t specialise on bikes/harleys and their dyno is a car dyno. Dyno is just a tool whether it be a bike or car but one of those two fellas id suggest is gonna be more knowledgeable and capable on working on your bike than the other. Hope this helps. 
  • Grease Monkey
    Grease Monkey
    3 years ago
    Christ that blokes knows how to make friends!
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