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204SE cam instal

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  • leachy
    leachy
    4 years ago
    Hi all,
    Im considering installing the 204SE cam into my 2016 low rider. At the moment it got just under 8000kms on it, i know it should have more. But while the cam chest is open what else would you recommend upgrading 

    Also does anyone know how the 2o4 cans effect fuel economy..

    Thanks
  • fatbat
    fatbat
    4 years ago
    Quoting leachy on 03 Jul 2020 11:00 PM

    Hi all,

    Im considering installing the 204SE cam into my 2016 low rider. At the moment it got just under 8000kms on it, i know it should have more. But while the cam chest is open what else would you recommend upgrading 

    Also does anyone know how the 2o4 cans effect fuel economy..

    Thanks

    Hi Leachy. I had se204 cams installed on my road glide custom. I didn’t install them personally and had a shop do the work. Used Quickee adjustable pushrods for ease and reducing labor, changed the lifters. Checked crank run out. Was advised to have a cam spacer on hand too but it wasn’t required. I ended up upgrading to a se clutch spring as I found the clutch was slipping afterwards even post clutch adjustment. This is unusual and might have been effected by the heavier weight of the tourer and I only had clutch slip in fifth and sixth gear under load.  In a lighter dyna I don’t think youd need to worry about that. It’s a cheap mod in any event. 
    I had the bike professionally dyno tuned and I was very happy with it. In terms of fuel economy I didn’t notice any significant change but on the figures I calculated on fuel fill to mileage I reckon fuel economy improved slightly but that’s more about a good tune than the cam. 

    It’s a very underrated cam. Doesn’t set the world on fire for top end power or low end torque but is a really good midrange cam for stock compression which goes well everywhere. It adds a nice change to the idle sound. The only criticism I could think of was I did have some detonation but that was in 40 degree weather riding mountain roads and I don’t think the fuel I was using was great. I think that was more about the conditions and fuel/tune than the cam. 

    Good luck and let us know how you go
  • leachy
    leachy
    4 years ago
    Thanks for the advice. Sounds like the right cam, dont want or need a high revving engine. I wont be doing the work either, but they are the parts ill change out too.
    Ill let you know how it goes hopefully ill get it done in the next week or so.

    Thanks for the info.
  • speedzter
    speedzter
    4 years ago
    Don't forget the Andrews 48, would give you a bit more early torque , or 57 for a bit more on the right side.

  • markwoumla
    markwoumla
    4 years ago
    Quoting leachy on 03 Jul 2020 11:00 PM

    Hi all,

    Im considering installing the 204SE cam into my 2016 low rider. At the moment it got just under 8000kms on it, i know it should have more. But while the cam chest is open what else would you recommend upgrading 

    Also does anyone know how the 2o4 cans effect fuel economy..

    Thanks

    I know you have low kms etc ,,  some shops like to install new lifters when installing new cams etc ,,,,they just dont want any come back because of a bad original  lifter...
    Tensioners should be goood ,,,, oil pump should be good ... Personally i like adjustable pushrods with just a cam swap , dont have to mess with the top end ,, your call...
    The heavy duty spring for you clutch is a good idea,,, but then again you could see how things are after install and tune..... 

    Have you got a tuner for the bike ?? You will have to sort something out there if you have not .....


  • leachy
    leachy
    4 years ago
    Thanks for the info. Yes i was planning on swapping out the parts using to SE lifters. Going to get local HD dealer to do it seeing the bike is still under warranty.
    Didnt want to push the limits of reliability either, so i like to replace those parts and do it once properly.

    Currently has stage 1, SE ventilator air filter and SE slipon muffler but will be swapping to V&H big shots in a little while.. i have the orange SE pro tuner.
  • Smokey61
    Smokey61
    4 years ago
    I did the SE204 cam conversion at home last month. My bike, '12 Wide Glide 103, has close to 30,000kms on it now. I used new cam bearings, S&S lifters, stock pushrods and replaced the breathers. It has an S&S classic air cleaner and V&H Big Shots. Had to buy a cam bearing puller and a Jim's cam bearing installer tool. Tuner is an SE Super Tuner Pro. Had it dynoed at the local dealer when finished. They asked if I wanted power or fuel economy, I chose economy with touring in mind. Fuel economy seems to have improved over stock, dynoed at 96 Horses and 109 Torques. Has more power exactly where I want it. No clutch slip so far. Some pinging evident under high load / low rev conditions. Idles like an Evo on the 'roids.
  • fatbat
    fatbat
    4 years ago
    Glad you mentioned the cam bearings Smokey. I forgot to but that is also the go whilst in the cam chest 
  • leachy
    leachy
    4 years ago
    Thanks smokey, sounds like that's what I'm looking for. Is it a noticeable seat of the pants difference. This bike will be used more for touring as well, just finding my VFR 800 a bit tiring on the neck for 500km plus day rides.
  • Retroman
    Retroman
    4 years ago

    Local Indy shop close to me in Perth WA SE204 cams are his cam of choice and/or what he keeps in stock.

    He fits them from 2007 to 2017. Changes the cam bearings to Torrington every time no exceptions.

    I do the subsequent ECM tuning for him thereafter , and there are never any "comebacks".

    Only trouble is there are not starter "canned calibrations" for all model years for 204's so some bikes are a messaround but I always get there.

    The customers always seem happy enough as is the Indy shop. Shops HATE grief so best avoided.

  • Smokey61
    Smokey61
    4 years ago
    Quoting leachy on 05 Jul 2020 07:43 AM

    Thanks smokey, sounds like that's what I'm looking for. Is it a noticeable seat of the pants difference. This bike will be used more for touring as well, just finding my VFR 800 a bit tiring on the neck for 500km plus day rides.

    "Is it a noticeable seat of the pants difference?"

    'Going for a blat' is now referred to as "Hammer Time".

    Had a conversation with old mate last Christmas, he was the Service Manager at Harley in Adelaide until just recently. He recommended the SE204s knowing what I like in a Harley. I like usable power and the 204s have a really nice spread of grunt starting around 2000rpm. I don't have any use for top end power. The most I've seen on the tacho since I've owned it was 5500rpm by which time my licence was screaming at me to slow down.
  • Grease Monkey
    Grease Monkey
    4 years ago
    You won't be disappointed with the 204's mate, I fitted a set to a mates 103 softy and tuned it with a less than steller exhaust , he is happy as, thats his sheet from a Dyno day just so you get an idea of the curve.

    dynorunShare_0_3.PNG
  • leachy
    leachy
    4 years ago
    Thanks all for the info it looks really encouraging there are so many options and equally as many opinions to go with that. I figured if HD were will to put them in an engine an still warrant it then it should be OK. Im just after something to warm the engine a little as its like a sleeping giant in its stock form. 
    Ill hopefully get to HD today to discuss what I want done.

    Regards
    Leachy.
  • leachy
    leachy
    4 years ago
    So update on the 204 cams. I am being strongly advised that in my bike and my style of riding I should install 254e cans. Has anyone used these cams?
    Regards
    Leachy
  • Grease Monkey
    Grease Monkey
    4 years ago
    Quoting leachy on 09 Jul 2020 08:08 PM

    So update on the 204 cams. I am being strongly advised that in my bike and my style of riding I should install 254e cans. Has anyone used these cams?

    Regards
    Leachy

    Yeah I dunno about them, probably want you to install them cause they have them on the shelf and nobody wants them, truly though I've never used them or know anyone that has so I guess I shouldn't comment.
  • fatbat
    fatbat
    4 years ago
    Quoting leachy on 09 Jul 2020 08:08 PM

    So update on the 204 cams. I am being strongly advised that in my bike and my style of riding I should install 254e cans. Has anyone used these cams?

    Regards
    Leachy

    Quoting Grease Monkey on 10 Jul 2020 08:12 AM

    Yeah I dunno about them, probably want you to install them cause they have them on the shelf and nobody wants them, truly though I've never used them or know anyone that has so I guess I shouldn't comment.

    Agree with Hilly. Plus the se254e cam intake close event is a fair bit later so your punch is gonna be higher in the midrange than the se204 cam 
  • FXDF08
    FXDF08
    4 years ago
    I had 204 in my 96ci FXDF and 254e in my 103ci FLTRX. Yes two different size bikes, but the 254e were a lot more easily tuned and pulled from idle to red line. I don’t have dyno print out, as went with a canned tune and never needed to touch it. 204 sounded great at idle and did pull hard. Exhaust also a critical component, so you must factor that in.
    I now have a 103ci FXDL and am eager to hear how you go. I actually think your riding style sounds best suited to the 254e. Plenty of torque from low, but still fun. I th8nk the 204 will produce more HP, but you want torque down low (left of Dyno print out). Good luck and let us know either way you go.
  • Grease Monkey
    Grease Monkey
    4 years ago
    Quoting FXDF08 on 10 Jul 2020 11:29 AM

    I had 204 in my 96ci FXDF and 254e in my 103ci FLTRX. Yes two different size bikes, but the 254e were a lot more easily tuned and pulled from idle to red line. I don’t have dyno print out, as went with a canned tune and never needed to touch it. 204 sounded great at idle and did pull hard. Exhaust also a critical component, so you must factor that in.

    I now have a 103ci FXDL and am eager to hear how you go. I actually think your riding style sounds best suited to the 254e. Plenty of torque from low, but still fun. I th8nk the 204 will produce more HP, but you want torque down low (left of Dyno print out). Good luck and let us know either way you go.

    And there we have it, first hand experience, thanks for speaking up mate, the E is one of their later grinds as far as twin cams go, I remember when it came out and we was discussing cams for a 103 bagger on HTT and I brought it up, the OP looked it up and said it was described as a hot rod cam, intake close ain't the be all and end all of timing events, the cr570-2 is evidence of that, interesting.
  • fatbat
    fatbat
    4 years ago
    Quoting FXDF08 on 10 Jul 2020 11:29 AM

    I had 204 in my 96ci FXDF and 254e in my 103ci FLTRX. Yes two different size bikes, but the 254e were a lot more easily tuned and pulled from idle to red line. I don’t have dyno print out, as went with a canned tune and never needed to touch it. 204 sounded great at idle and did pull hard. Exhaust also a critical component, so you must factor that in.

    I now have a 103ci FXDL and am eager to hear how you go. I actually think your riding style sounds best suited to the 254e. Plenty of torque from low, but still fun. I th8nk the 204 will produce more HP, but you want torque down low (left of Dyno print out). Good luck and let us know either way you go.

    Quoting Grease Monkey on 10 Jul 2020 11:36 PM

    And there we have it, first hand experience, thanks for speaking up mate, the E is one of their later grinds as far as twin cams go, I remember when it came out and we was discussing cams for a 103 bagger on HTT and I brought it up, the OP looked it up and said it was described as a hot rod cam, intake close ain't the be all and end all of timing events, the cr570-2 is evidence of that, interesting.

    The cycle Rama 570 cam’s intake close is at 32 degrees. It’s early which is why it produces lots of torque down low. 
    The se204 cam’s intake close is at 34 degrees. 

    The se254e cam’s intake close is at 43 degrees. 

    Agree intake close timing isn’t the be all and end all but it’s a key timing event that dictates when the cam is on  
  • leachy
    leachy
    4 years ago
    I'm sure either way it's an improvement over the stock. The HD guy seemed to understand my description of how I ride and that when he thought the 254e cans would be better. I did say I wanted reliability and am not looking for top end up, but a good spread. He did agree that the 204 do have that nice idle sound, and probably better than the 254e but he then added you dont ride a bike idling around. They had neither in stock so it didnt really matter. 
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