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Nightster charging issues

Nightster charging issues

night_prowler
4 years ago

Quoting beaglebasher on 15 May 2020 10:39 PM
Hmmmmmmm, the plot thickens.
I am sticking to my original diagnosis.
The battery is fucked.
How did you go with the multi meter np?

As I said in the previous post 13 standing volts, 12.7 with ignition on, 7 while cranking and 14 at idle and when increasing RPM It stays steady about there never going above 14.1 which I thought may have been the issue but I don’t have any standard figures to run off other than what John R. has said.
As for my CCA theory and the higher compression, I find it really odd that I never had these problems during the 12 months/13,000kms I’ve owned the bike up until now, if it were the problem I’m sure I would have come across much earlier. I’ll be fucked if it is the case because apparently there ain’t anything over 300CCA that’ll fit a sporty. That’s according to battery world, he was actually suspect that it even is 300 as he said none of the major brands make 300CCA batteries that small, let alone a brand he has never heard of.

Something about the previous battery cranking so much faster than the new Power battery is one thing that is standing out to me at the moment. As soon as I hit the starter with the new one in I immediately noticed how slow it cranked. Odd because it should theoretically crank quicker being higher CCA.

So I’m leaning towards new battery right now and I’m happy to give it a go and go back to a HD/Dekka or maybe Yuasa but I’d rather check out other avenues before I flutter 120-140$ for nothing if there is a problem elsewhere. Is it possible for a starter to get sticky or seize up occasionally? Could a starter relay cause similar issues? I’m a total rookie when it comes to the black arts of auto electrics to any suggestions would be great.

Cheers guys, hope you’se are getting amongst it this weekend...

markwoumla
4 years ago

Mate, anything under 9.5 volts at cranking is a tired or faulty battery... Can happen with new batteries ,, that's just the way it is....
Your figure of 7 volts at cranking tells us there is a cell down ,, ie , battery is fucked.....

Lets say you had a good battery fully charged, (say 12.75 -- 13 volts) ,,,, But your voltage regulator was faulty ,,, And your stator was faulty......
You install battery in bike and connect it up …… Connect multi meter to battery to check lowest voltage at cranking /start up ,,,, The lowest voltage would not /should not go below 10 volts...… (Because of meter accuracy it may go down to the high 9s for a milli second)….
In above case , the battery would eventually loose charge with riding and starting , leaving you stranded...And eventually fuck the good battery...

In your case , after charging,, battery is showing say 12.7 volts,,, thats good , but only half the story ....the real story is cranking amps when under load, ie , (cranking / starting bike)..... You battery is not passing this test....(Not by a fucking long shot)….
Your voltage reg and stator , (under this simple test), are passing there test ,,, as the stator must be pumping out ac voltage, because the voltage regulator is pumping out 14 volts dc , (which is acceptable for charging purposes) , at higher rpms.....

So in a nutshell a new battery is required ,,,, But for your own piece of mind ,, when you go to dealer or who ever, to buy a new battery,,, have the old battery fully charged as best you can, and get them to load test it ……

dicko
4 years ago

Quoting beaglebasher on 15 May 2020 10:39 PM
Hmmmmmmm, the plot thickens.
I am sticking to my original diagnosis.
The battery is fucked.
How did you go with the multi meter np?

Quoting night_prowler on 16 May 2020 01:48 AM
As I said in the previous post 13 standing volts, 12.7 with ignition on, 7 while cranking and 14 at idle and when increasing RPM It stays steady about there never going above 14.1 which I thought may have been the issue but I don’t have any standard figures to run off other than what John R. has said.
As for my CCA theory and the higher compression, I find it really odd that I never had these problems during the 12 months/13,000kms I’ve owned the bike up until now, if it were the problem I’m sure I would have come across much earlier. I’ll be fucked if it is the case because apparently there ain’t anything over 300CCA that’ll fit a sporty. That’s according to battery world, he was actually suspect that it even is 300 as he said none of the major brands make 300CCA batteries that small, let alone a brand he has never heard of.

Something about the previous battery cranking so much faster than the new Power battery is one thing that is standing out to me at the moment. As soon as I hit the starter with the new one in I immediately noticed how slow it cranked. Odd because it should theoretically crank quicker being higher CCA.

So I’m leaning towards new battery right now and I’m happy to give it a go and go back to a HD/Dekka or maybe Yuasa but I’d rather check out other avenues before I flutter 120-140$ for nothing if there is a problem elsewhere. Is it possible for a starter to get sticky or seize up occasionally? Could a starter relay cause similar issues? I’m a total rookie when it comes to the black arts of auto electrics to any suggestions would be great.

Cheers guys, hope you’se are getting amongst it this weekend...

I'll add a bit of experience here, I had a new battery into my roadking ( from the harley shop) and after a while it started to not crank, I replaced it with another new battery and the same thing happened. Since i had kept the old battery i put it on the charger in the shed and found it had a short circuit cell. I then began to get check engine light intermittently, but never found the problem because every time i got it near a mutimeter to check the regulator the check engine light disappeared. Fuck it so i put a new regulator in and every thing is then fine.
Diagnosis is the shorted cell battery fucked the regulator, so next battery wasn't charging properly.

so there you go replace regulator and battery after a faulty battery has been in the bike, if problems keep occurring. ????
Thats what i did .

night_prowler
4 years ago

Thanks boys, I really appreciate the input, I’m going to go with that on Monday and check the old unit... I’ve been pretty suss on it since the first start... if it is the case I’ll be stoked because it’s relatively cheap to replace!

AJ56
4 years ago

I think 14.1 V at 2000RPM if standard. I would be looking for a drain when the bike is sitting ( Parasitic Drain) Google tells you how to check. If that's ok the the battery is not holding the charge, possibly a dead cell, poor connection on the terminals, bad regulator but 14.1v is what is required to run the bike. It shouldn't go above that if it does it is a bad Regulator which would cook the battery and possibly the whole elec system on the bike.

https://carlsalter.com/mcpdf/Harley%20Davidson-2008%20Electrical%20Diagnostics%20Manual.pdf

night_prowler
4 years ago

Battery was fucked, got another under warranty but I’m not expecting it to last, at $115 for a (supposably) 300CCA battery I’m pretty sure it’s cheap Chinese shit, can’t find a website for them, reviews or anything really. The brand is called Power AGM, I would avoid them if anyone is buying a new battery and you come across them, may have just been bad luck with a faulty unit but I reckon you get what you pay for.... Thanks for the help guys, I’ve learnt something.

fatbat
4 years ago

If it was stuffed under warranty and you weren’t happy with the replacement battery, you could have demanded a refund and bought battery you wanted.

markwoumla
4 years ago

night prowler,,
Seeing your now an expert with batteries now, do this for kicks ,,, and you may learn something..... First off though,,, I would put new battery on trickle charger overnight to make sure new battery is at fully charge, (new batteries can be setting on shelf for awhile) ,,,, When charged take a voltage reading.....
Connect battery to bike and take a reading while cranking, (what is the lowest voltage) ?? ..... Also voltage reading at 2000 rpm ?? .....

With regard replacing with same no name battery ,,,, Hopefully you will be lucky this time.......

tussuck
4 years ago

Quoting night_prowler on 20 May 2020 07:02 PM
Battery was fucked, got another under warranty but I’m not expecting it to last, at $115 for a (supposably) 300CCA battery I’m pretty sure it’s cheap Chinese shit, can’t find a website for them, reviews or anything really. The brand is called Power AGM, I would avoid them if anyone is buying a new battery and you come across them, may have just been bad luck with a faulty unit but I reckon you get what you pay for.... Thanks for the help guys, I’ve learnt something.

Theres a crowd in Sydney that sell on eBAy and they are SSB or something and then they post all over the place for bugger all. ALWAYS had good results and GOOD SERVICE from them. Really nice to have a local that I can ring and sort out any issues.

night_prowler
4 years ago

Quoting fatbat on 20 May 2020 10:30 PM
If it was stuffed under warranty and you weren’t happy with the replacement battery, you could have demanded a refund and bought battery you wanted.

I wasn’t going go into it but I had a run in with the bloke when I took the battery back to him, I’ll spare ya’s the details but we ended up having an argument, I don’t like trashing someone who isn’t around to defend themselves but the guy was a dead set fuckwit, I did tell him I had no faith in the brand and I didn’t even really want a replacement and things got pretty heated from that point, in the end I wasn’t going to go to war over $115. I needed a battery right then and there, I’m flat out with work and my wife is 40 weeks pregnant so I’ve got enough going on without fighting some dick head for money like that. I got the battery and unlike the previous one it cranked really strong from the moment I fitted it, the last one it was super slow from the get go and I always thought it was odd so hopefully it’ll go then distance but if it does take a premature shit I will obviously never buy another.
I don’t know how many members are in the Northern Rivers area but the business in question is Alstonville discount batteries and trailer hire, I’d fucking avoid them altogether. Hired a trailer once also and that was a fucking fiasco as well so I guess I should have known, but you try to support the little guys as best you can.

Cheers for the tip Mark I’ll give that a crack, and Tussuck, do you have the eBay store name for future reference? Thanks guys

Krash Kinkade
4 years ago

Quoting night_prowler on 07 May 2020 05:59 AM
Cheers guys, I’ve ridden to work today and rode it around town yesterday, stopping and starting it a few times even while cold to see if it would play up but its going like clockwork... my uneducated theory is because of the higher compression and a standard cca battery, perhaps the corrosion on the terminals might have been just enough to slow it up and prevent it from starting. As I said previously, putting it on the charger shows just a cunt hair off of full charge so it seems like unless it’s at 100% charge it doesn’t want to turn over.
I could also go to start it tomorrow and it may not fire and my entire theory will be a load of shit but anyway I appreciate the replies.

One thing I will say, is the old HD gel battery that came out of it, I can’t remember the cca’s but you only had to breathe on the start button and it would fire into life. Probably should have just ordered the same one again.

just saw this, the sporty has a lower ratio primary drive. so with higher cranking pressure, needs a higher CCA battery. ( just personal experience )
get an SSB 450 CCA battery. that will spin it quicker!!
I did have a problem with positive terminal breaking off with one, but the Second SSB 450 CCA replacement has now done more work than the first & working like a charm. Also a tip, always check your regulator is working when you fire it up and get it up to over 3k rev.
good luck . mine is a Carb with high cranking pressure few more cubic inch than stock & the stock AGM HD battery felt like it was going to die cranking it, took out fitted the SSB 450 CCA AGM style & one touch of starter & it spins motor quick every time.
good luck

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