Hard starting

Topics

Hard starting

1/2

ausibatla
5 years ago

G'day fellas,
I haven't been here for a while. Been busy building up a new bike.
It's a 1988 Softail Springer with a mildly worked 1340 EVO in it. Because I got a frame from
overseas and there was no registered VIN I had to apply to construct a motorcycle.
I'll try and post a photo when I've finished. Once I'd finished it I had to pay $500 to a Dept. of Transport
approved engineer to check it. It is basically a 1988 stock Harley Springer but it is registered as a
2016 Custom Motorcycle. What a useless bunch of bureaucrats they are.
Anyway over the past six months or so I haven't ridden it that much but it is always on the CTEK and
the battery is always fully charged. At least once a week I'll wander over to the workshop and run her up.
All I do is turn the starter over until it's unable to turn anymore. I'll leave it for an hour or so until
the CTEK is showing a full charge again and it starts up straight away. It will also start if I put the jumper
leads on it. But when it fails to start first up there is plenty of power in the battery and it turns over easily.
Once it has started and I go for a blast it will start every time no matter how many stops I make on the ride.
I have a 42mm flat slide Mikuni carb on it.
Anybody had this problem before. I'd appreciate any ideas. I keep thinking buggered battery but then It starts
and keeps starting all day.

perthhog
5 years ago

Quoting ausibatla on 17 Aug 2019 03:13 AMedited: 17 Aug 2019 03:19 AM
G'day fellas,
I haven't been here for a while. Been busy building up a new bike.
It's a 1988 Softail Springer with a mildly worked 1340 EVO in it. Because I got a frame from
overseas and there was no registered VIN I had to apply to construct a motorcycle.
I'll try and post a photo when I've finished. Once I'd finished it I had to pay $500 to a Dept. of Transport
approved engineer to check it. It is basically a 1988 stock Harley Springer but it is registered as a
2016 Custom Motorcycle. What a useless bunch of bureaucrats they are.
Anyway over the past six months or so I haven't ridden it that much but it is always on the CTEK and
the battery is always fully charged. At least once a week I'll wander over to the workshop and run her up.
All I do is turn the starter over until it's unable to turn anymore. I'll leave it for an hour or so until
the CTEK is showing a full charge again and it starts up straight away. It will also start if I put the jumper
leads on it. But when it fails to start first up there is plenty of power in the battery and it turns over easily.
Once it has started and I go for a blast it will start every time no matter how many stops I make on the ride.
I have a 42mm flat slide Mikuni carb on it.
Anybody had this problem before. I'd appreciate any ideas. I keep thinking buggered battery but then It starts
and keeps starting all day.

Nice looking m@chine you have there and yes have had those issues before too
Do you know if you’re running std ignition system or is it aftermarket ;
And what battery are you running now , as I’ve found with the
After market ignitions if battery is a bit Suss or low on juice it does
Exactly as you have described I run ssb hvt1 I think it is
In my evo softails 425cca more than a deka or the Oem harley battery
If you run a aftermarket ignition some have led signal lights on them
And you can see them trigger as you are cranking it
No signal = no or weak spark

tussuck
5 years ago

I'm not sure if the turn the bike over until the battery is flat is the right way to do it. Just squirt oil into the jugs and then leave on the charger.

ausibatla
5 years ago

Quoting ausibatla on 17 Aug 2019 03:13 AMedited: 17 Aug 2019 03:19 AM
G'day fellas,
I haven't been here for a while. Been busy building up a new bike.
It's a 1988 Softail Springer with a mildly worked 1340 EVO in it. Because I got a frame from
overseas and there was no registered VIN I had to apply to construct a motorcycle.
I'll try and post a photo when I've finished. Once I'd finished it I had to pay $500 to a Dept. of Transport
approved engineer to check it. It is basically a 1988 stock Harley Springer but it is registered as a
2016 Custom Motorcycle. What a useless bunch of bureaucrats they are.
Anyway over the past six months or so I haven't ridden it that much but it is always on the CTEK and
the battery is always fully charged. At least once a week I'll wander over to the workshop and run her up.
All I do is turn the starter over until it's unable to turn anymore. I'll leave it for an hour or so until
the CTEK is showing a full charge again and it starts up straight away. It will also start if I put the jumper
leads on it. But when it fails to start first up there is plenty of power in the battery and it turns over easily.
Once it has started and I go for a blast it will start every time no matter how many stops I make on the ride.
I have a 42mm flat slide Mikuni carb on it.
Anybody had this problem before. I'd appreciate any ideas. I keep thinking buggered battery but then It starts
and keeps starting all day.

Quoting perthhog on 17 Aug 2019 06:37 AMedited: 17 Aug 2019 06:38 AM
Nice looking m@chine you have there and yes have had those issues before too
Do you know if you’re running std ignition system or is it aftermarket ;
And what battery are you running now , as I’ve found with the
After market ignitions if battery is a bit Suss or low on juice it does
Exactly as you have described I run ssb hvt1 I think it is
In my evo softails 425cca more than a deka or the Oem harley battery
If you run a aftermarket ignition some have led signal lights on them
And you can see them trigger as you are cranking it
No signal = no or weak spark

G'day perthhog,
I'm running an Ultima Digital single fire Ignition system with VOES set at 6.0 in/hg
and a genuine Harley battery. I thought I bought a new battery about 18 months ago but the only receipt I
can find is dated 2015. But last time I checked the voltage on the battery it was around 12.8 and when
I hit the starter it only dropped about one volt. I do a CCA test with my little multi tester but I don't know
how accurate it is. The strange thing is it won't start first up but leave it for an hour or two and it starts
O.K.
Cheers.

speedzter
5 years ago

Try a cranking voltage test. ( as you say it only dropped by 1 volt ? )
When it does start from cold, does it need choke for a while to stay running ?
Vacuum fuel tap ?
Do you give it a few pumps before starting ? pull the cover and see if the pump actually squirts .

ausibatla
5 years ago

Quoting tussuck on 18 Aug 2019 12:41 AM
I'm not sure if the turn the bike over until the battery is flat is the right way to do it. Just squirt oil into the jugs and then leave on the charger.

Thanks for the info tussock.
I never leave it long enough to worry about the pistons sticking. The most I
leave it would be 2 weeks. I usually fire it up every week if I don't have a
ride on and run her up to operating temp. The thing is it won't start firstup
but if I leave it one or two hours it starts no worries.
Cheers.

ausibatla
5 years ago

Quoting speedzter on 18 Aug 2019 01:38 AMedited: 18 Aug 2019 01:40 AM
Try a cranking voltage test. ( as you say it only dropped by 1 volt ? )
When it does start from cold, does it need choke for a while to stay running ?
Vacuum fuel tap ?
Do you give it a few pumps before starting ? pull the cover and see if the pump actually squirts .

Hey speedzter,
I've done a cold cranking test but only using my small multi tester so
don't know how accurate it is. It always needs choke when starting and I always give
it a couple of squirts. Ordinary tap. As I said to the other blokes, it won't start first up but I go
over one or two hours later and it fires up first time.
Cheers.

Ratbob
5 years ago

It could also be a fuel issue. I know a few years ago I couldn’t leave my 69 Bonny or K1 Honda 4 for more than a week before the float bowls would start to dry out and that nasty unleaded would leave a gel build up. Sometimes the float would stick open so fuel would piss out. Other times the float would stick closed so no start.
So I thought I’d leave the fuel on all the time but one night the K1 dropped all its fuel, so that didn’t work.
Next strategy was to turn the fuel on and let it soak while I cleaned the plugs, both bikes then started every time.

ausibatla
5 years ago

Quoting Ratbob on 18 Aug 2019 01:55 AMedited: 18 Aug 2019 01:56 AM
It could also be a fuel issue. I know a few years ago I couldn’t leave my 69 Bonny or K1 Honda 4 for more than a week before the float bowls would start to dry out and that nasty unleaded would leave a gel build up. Sometimes the float would stick open so fuel would piss out. Other times the float would stick closed so no start.
So I thought I’d leave the fuel on all the time but one night the K1 dropped all its fuel, so that didn’t work.
Next strategy was to turn the fuel on and let it soak while I cleaned the plugs, both bikes then started every time.

Thanks for the tip Ratbob. I will check it out but it's
never been a problem before but anything is possible.
Cheers.

perthhog
5 years ago

Quoting ausibatla on 17 Aug 2019 03:13 AMedited: 17 Aug 2019 03:19 AM
G'day fellas,
I haven't been here for a while. Been busy building up a new bike.
It's a 1988 Softail Springer with a mildly worked 1340 EVO in it. Because I got a frame from
overseas and there was no registered VIN I had to apply to construct a motorcycle.
I'll try and post a photo when I've finished. Once I'd finished it I had to pay $500 to a Dept. of Transport
approved engineer to check it. It is basically a 1988 stock Harley Springer but it is registered as a
2016 Custom Motorcycle. What a useless bunch of bureaucrats they are.
Anyway over the past six months or so I haven't ridden it that much but it is always on the CTEK and
the battery is always fully charged. At least once a week I'll wander over to the workshop and run her up.
All I do is turn the starter over until it's unable to turn anymore. I'll leave it for an hour or so until
the CTEK is showing a full charge again and it starts up straight away. It will also start if I put the jumper
leads on it. But when it fails to start first up there is plenty of power in the battery and it turns over easily.
Once it has started and I go for a blast it will start every time no matter how many stops I make on the ride.
I have a 42mm flat slide Mikuni carb on it.
Anybody had this problem before. I'd appreciate any ideas. I keep thinking buggered battery but then It starts
and keeps starting all day.

Quoting perthhog on 17 Aug 2019 06:37 AMedited: 17 Aug 2019 06:38 AM
Nice looking m@chine you have there and yes have had those issues before too
Do you know if you’re running std ignition system or is it aftermarket ;
And what battery are you running now , as I’ve found with the
After market ignitions if battery is a bit Suss or low on juice it does
Exactly as you have described I run ssb hvt1 I think it is
In my evo softails 425cca more than a deka or the Oem harley battery
If you run a aftermarket ignition some have led signal lights on them
And you can see them trigger as you are cranking it
No signal = no or weak spark

Quoting ausibatla on 18 Aug 2019 01:34 AM
G'day perthhog,
I'm running an Ultima Digital single fire Ignition system with VOES set at 6.0 in/hg
and a genuine Harley battery. I thought I bought a new battery about 18 months ago but the only receipt I
can find is dated 2015. But last time I checked the voltage on the battery it was around 12.8 and when
I hit the starter it only dropped about one volt. I do a CCA test with my little multi tester but I don't know
how accurate it is. The strange thing is it won't start first up but leave it for an hour or two and it starts
O.K.
Cheers.

Ok good than you have leds on your ignition so take the nose cone cover off and whist you are
Cranking look at the leds to see if there flashing , in regards to fuel tap I always turn it off
And than let the bike run out of fuel before putting it to sleep ,
And with my bikes I don’t tend to use the choke/ enriched a couple of squirts of the throttle
Than fire them up if I do use choke that gets taken off as soon as it’s running
Have found that thay start easy that way But that’s with cv carbies
The other thing is you may want to put some new plugs in if it’s been fouling .
Is it rich on start up when it does start up ?
And check as speedster said and pop your air cleaner off and see if the carbie squirts

ausibatla
5 years ago

Quoting perthhog on 17 Aug 2019 06:37 AMedited: 17 Aug 2019 06:38 AM
Nice looking m@chine you have there and yes have had those issues before too
Do you know if you’re running std ignition system or is it aftermarket ;
And what battery are you running now , as I’ve found with the
After market ignitions if battery is a bit Suss or low on juice it does
Exactly as you have described I run ssb hvt1 I think it is
In my evo softails 425cca more than a deka or the Oem harley battery
If you run a aftermarket ignition some have led signal lights on them
And you can see them trigger as you are cranking it
No signal = no or weak spark

Quoting ausibatla on 18 Aug 2019 01:34 AM
G'day perthhog,
I'm running an Ultima Digital single fire Ignition system with VOES set at 6.0 in/hg
and a genuine Harley battery. I thought I bought a new battery about 18 months ago but the only receipt I
can find is dated 2015. But last time I checked the voltage on the battery it was around 12.8 and when
I hit the starter it only dropped about one volt. I do a CCA test with my little multi tester but I don't know
how accurate it is. The strange thing is it won't start first up but leave it for an hour or two and it starts
O.K.
Cheers.

Quoting perthhog on 18 Aug 2019 02:50 AMedited: 18 Aug 2019 02:54 AM
Ok good than you have leds on your ignition so take the nose cone cover off and whist you are
Cranking look at the leds to see if there flashing , in regards to fuel tap I always turn it off
And than let the bike run out of fuel before putting it to sleep ,
And with my bikes I don’t tend to use the choke/ enriched a couple of squirts of the throttle
Than fire them up if I do use choke that gets taken off as soon as it’s running
Have found that thay start easy that way But that’s with cv carbies
The other thing is you may want to put some new plugs in if it’s been fouling .
Is it rich on start up when it does start up ?
And check as speedster said and pop your air cleaner off and see if the carbie squirts

perthhog,
Just been over the workshop and checked the battery after being fully charged. It is reading 13.1v
I the stuck my small multimeter on it and hit the starter. It dropped to 4v but still started the bike easily.
This is not making any sense to me. If I have a dead cell then why does it start at all?
Perhaps I do need a new battery. I have always used genuine Harley batteries and the don't show CCA's
the battery and Harley dealers don't know what it is.
Should I buy an after market battery and can you recommend on that will fit an '88 - '95 Softail?
Cheers.

perthhog
5 years ago

Ssb agm battery it I get mine of eBay 4wd mob
I use a hvt1. By memory in my softails
Check them out if you get one you will be
Impressed shit over the gen harley cca wise
Yer I know harley don’t even no what there’s are

Funny thing is if get a ssb agm it’s case looks
The same as harley one without the logo on it

Edit hvt5. For evo softail

Wideglider
5 years ago

Correct me if I'm missing something here.
You say it cranks over fast enough everytime? If so this means the battery & starter are doing their job - time to move on from the battery & look elsewhere.
Check fuel & spark (using methods that have previously been suggested).

speedzter
5 years ago

If your battery really drops to 4v , then this is your problem.
Especially when you said it starts ok when you jump start it.

speedzter
5 years ago

Also , don't believe advertising when it comes to cranking amps. I have a nifty meter/analyzer that doesn't lie .

Wideglider
5 years ago

Quoting speedzter on 18 Aug 2019 01:28 PM
If your battery really drops to 4v , then this is your problem.
Especially when you said it starts ok when you jump start it.

It dropped to 4v
Whoops, sorry I do stand corrected - I missed that bit.

Wideglider
5 years ago

Yeh, correct - if it drops that low to 4 volts, it won't have enough voltage to operate the ignition electronic module.

perthhog
5 years ago

Quoting Wideglider on 19 Aug 2019 01:08 AMedited: 19 Aug 2019 01:09 AM
Yeh, correct - if it drops that low to 4 volts, it won't have enough voltage to operate the ignition electronic module.

Anything under about 10.5 v with aftermarket ignition they normally have
Starting issues I’ve found on crank

ausibatla
5 years ago

Quoting perthhog on 18 Aug 2019 10:56 AMedited: 19 Aug 2019 01:32 AM
Ssb agm battery it I get mine of eBay 4wd mob
I use a hvt1. By memory in my softails
Check them out if you get one you will be
Impressed shit over the gen harley cca wise
Yer I know harley don’t even no what there’s are

Funny thing is if get a ssb agm it’s case looks
The same as harley one without the logo on it

Edit hvt5. For evo softail

Thanks for that mate. I've been onto the same mob on ebay and I can get the SSB HVT 1
but it only has the positive terminal on the right. I need it on the left and he says they don't
have them. I'm looking at a HVT 4.
Cheers

ausibatla
5 years ago

Quoting perthhog on 18 Aug 2019 10:56 AMedited: 19 Aug 2019 01:32 AM
Ssb agm battery it I get mine of eBay 4wd mob
I use a hvt1. By memory in my softails
Check them out if you get one you will be
Impressed shit over the gen harley cca wise
Yer I know harley don’t even no what there’s are

Funny thing is if get a ssb agm it’s case looks
The same as harley one without the logo on it

Edit hvt5. For evo softail

Quoting ausibatla on 19 Aug 2019 02:11 AM
Thanks for that mate. I've been onto the same mob on ebay and I can get the SSB HVT 1
but it only has the positive terminal on the right. I need it on the left and he says they don't
have them. I'm looking at a HVT 4.
Cheers

Also thanks to everybody for your input. Greatly appreciated.
Cheers.

Topics

1/2

Hard starting

Hard starting

ausibatla

perthhog

tussuck

ausibatla

speedzter

ausibatla

ausibatla

Ratbob

ausibatla

perthhog

ausibatla

perthhog

Wideglider

speedzter

speedzter

Wideglider

Wideglider

perthhog

ausibatla

ausibatla