gday ......

 

i have just registered so brand new to this site.

 

this is my stock standard 1972 shovel with about 11,000

genuine miles.
 

i ve got a bit of a problem at the moment with it

and im hoping someone might throw some direction

in a  way of prior experience with theirs perhaps.

ive had  NO  problems starting and the bike idles ok,

but as soon as i give it stick, it farts non stop through the carbie only.

the plugs foul up to black soot, very quickly and 

at the moment and because of this, i cant ride it.
 
the things that i have already done are:

 
* bendix carbie has had new harley genuine kit installed.

* carbie to manifold rings, replaced.

* new points and condensor 

* new 98 fuel added to tank.

* checked compression....good at 110.

* was timed, valves set and tuned about 300 miles ago.

 

till then, the bike ran like a clock.
 
any stabs from anyone?
 

cheers

met
 

Hi mate,

I also have a 1972 FLH Shovel. My bike had exactly the same symptoms as yours, however mine is running a 90 CV Keihen Carby. As per the previous post the carby was running way too lean. I changed over the idle and top end jets and it now runs and idles like a dream.

From all accounts I was advised by all those who are supposed to be in the know, to either tune up my CV carby, check for manifold leaks or change the carby over to a E series S&S. If you want to keep it original and run the Bendix you might want to take it to someone who will take a fortune off you to rebuild your Bendix.

Its frustrating I know and costly. I spent hundreds of dollars before changing over the jets which cost me twelve dollars.

The Shovels are an awesome bike you just have to spend every second weekend maintaining or upgrading them.

Labor of love.

Good luck, let me know how you go.

Leigh

met. nice example of the era...my opinion without seeing or hearing the bike would be its running to rich,& id bet the idle jet (low speed jet)is to large.
take it out read the number on it.check if its what standard carbs run.main jet wont matter so much cause it doesnt operate till your in the higher rev bracket..
but plugs that soot up quick & back firing through carb is a tell tale sign of the above.do that first. before assuming other stuff.....also pretty sure there should be a rubber plug covering the said jet, make sure its still in place..

hi all.....and thanks for all your replies.

im just going through them all now, as im back from the xmas holidays.

kiwidave......the carbie actually backfires. i have taken the air cleaner plate of and the there
is a round black stain of carbon, where she backfires....the air cleaner element is wet with
fuel.....

arrowhead.....the bendix carbie on the bike has already had a brand new harley original kit
fitted on it.....i would prefer to keep the bike original but i will jump over to another carb, if
im forced.

kickinon.....im tending to think the same as you on this. i think the bike is running too rich
because it backfires through the carb, it soots plugs in a matter of minutes and when the air cleaner
is of the bike i can see fuel pouring out whilst im trying to start it.....i am wandering whether adjusting
air mixture screw might make a difference before i decide to look at the jets...

bangkok bob......your explanation sounds also close to the money, because prior to this i had
a perfect running bike for 300 miles or so.....so it very much sounds like something has come out of adjustment.
what is involved in checking if the idle jet has come undone....? will i need to take of the carbie?
the squirt is strong and it almost soaks the carbie.....i noticed

im going to post some more pics and possibly run a short video whilst im trying to start the bike......

i've made a couple of you tube videos of the beast and its
coughing blues.

i decided to not run the bike too much, just in case any further damage
occurs as a consequence of my mechanical ignorance towards these engines.

if i take it around the block, it will backfire like there's no tomorrow.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W6Q7yK1jv2E&feature=youtu.be


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=peApJbrrFjA&feature=youtu.be

met, if fuel is coming from the carb its a sign of the float level, usually because the wire clip that holds the needle to the brass or plastic float is to tight,
when fitting the needle let it hang loose on its mount,(dont pinch the wire clip up to tight to the float) if it still leaks adjust the float level,
and as my last post before be sure the idle jet is correct & rubber bung must be installed,dont worry about the main jet its probably a #160 & will be o.k.,

Hi Met, only just caught on to this thread. Ran a 1981 FXEF with a much modified Bendix 38mm w/adj main jet for 20 years. Off the bat following on what KD BB and kickinon have said, I'd say too much fuel is being pushed through I would look at Float bowl height,  check fuel needle valve slides in/out smoothly and actually seats properly. Check Idle needle tip is clean and straight, put a cotton bud soaked in acetone down the idle tube and clean it up a bit. Carefully turn the needle down until it seats and back out 1 1/2 turns. Bike will start at this setting and should be pretty close to Ok . Fine tune it afterwards. If the bike ran OK before you shouldn't need to do anything with the main jet. I'll insert a couple of files on a Zenith/Bendix.

Cheers,

Cris.

BendixCarb.pdf

Zenith-Bendix_Carb.pdf

bangkok bob............yes its a brass float in that
and yes i will need to find someone down here to take it to.
i see you are in wa....not sure if you know anyone good here in sydney.

kickinon......it looks more and more that this is a carbie issue and im thinking
whether its a worthwhile thing, to swap it for a s&s or a mikuni...?

yeah thanks to both the don and kiwidave.

cris....i see you are at port stephens.

i ll bring the carbie in to you to have a look at,
if you're working in the industry and have a workshop going....

let me know....

cris,

i had a new genuine hd carbie kit that was installed by someone about 3 months ago,
who also did the manifold gaskets and tuned and timed the bike.....i did this because it was then doing what its doing now.
(carbie spitting fuel and backfiring) i remember distinctly him setting the carbie float because he used a 3/16 drill bit as a guide
to get his clearance.....
its really strange......because after the carbie kit was put in 300 miles ago and the bike tuned,
all the problems dissapeared and i thought great....
i rode it for 300 miles and it was running like a clock.....
now 300 miles later, i have again this problem with the carbie.....

im happy to pull out the carbie and go through it again with you, but do you think
it could be that the actual carbie body that has damage....hense the thinking behind getting a new s&s?

i had a look at all the wiring....seems all intact.
i might however invest on some new - and + battery cabling just in case.
i will go through it again one more time and procceed on
to the mechanical balancers....(learning all the time).
i ve done some reading on them and as you say, this sounds
like it may be it....i dont see however how they would undo themselves as they are meant to move marginally
and within the confines of their springs, apart offcourse from that main long centre bolt which holds them all in place...
(i havent checked that)
i would need to take of the plate which holds the points and the condenser....
then who knows what i find.....?
i guess rust could have set in, making all that area non operational...
cris, i will be going up north for a week or so for my daughters b'day....should be back around the 20th..
i will go over the wiring tomorrow before i leave and once i get back i will look forward in tackling
this riddle.....

frustrating but enjoying it at the same time......

stay tuned for more drama

cris,


i forgot to ask...

the fuel plunger with the leather boot in the carb you are talking about, is that shown as number 19
on the pdf you sent me?

hi cris,

well i think i resolved the problem with this shovel.
whilst i was on holidays up north i decided to buy some spark plugs and another rectifier from harley.
the one that was on the bike was already relatively new, but another one i might be a good
idea just to have around......just like having another set of points and plugs handy.
i got back and started the bike and confirming the problem was still there.
i pulled apart the entire points system and the counterbalances only to find they were both weights
were operating like new.....no rust and no issues there.
i remember that i had already put on the new second set of points before
i went away and decided to now also put on the new rectifier i had brought back with me.....
started the bike and already i felt a difference.
i took it around the block......no backfiring.
next day i decided to take it for a 50km run ....
no issues. ........ which may suggest i had originally kitted a faulty rectifier that lasted for a certain time before it gave way?

its weird that all that havvock could have been cause by a little round thing....

i am happy though and relieved.....

whats your take on this....?

i did notice a little engine oil whilst i was pulling out the points plate...
this oil had not fouled up the points in any way as it was minimal....perhaps 10 drops.
in any case, is this normal for oil to seep down in that points area?

yeah thanks bob.....what needs to be changed here to stop the oil coming into the points compartment?

thanks bob....i will look into it.
its neverending with these old 1's

yeah thanks cris.
these things are so damn different to all those jap bikes ive owned in the past.....not better, not worse...just different.
but its so damn sweet to ride the thing, in a very different way.
the manuals i have two of them, including the orange cover one for shovels where this picture is from....
the bikes come and go but the manuals stay.............i have about 60 manuals of different bikes ive owned in the past which i never throw away....
i do find however, real direction from people like you, bob, and all the others, who have cut their teeth and have been there before, are a much more valuable source of
information.....hence the forum question i originally posted.
cheers and thanks again.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XMwSarFU9dU&feature=youtu.be

Just found this Thread.
Good informative read.
Thanks.