Hey guys,

How important is changing the oil & filter at the 500km mark on a new bike?

I'll be getting the full first service at around 1000 - 1200 kms most likely, but was wondering about the benefits of dumping the oil and filter early.

Thanks

 

Blah

It's very important if you're interested in keeping your machine healthy.

Three reasons,
1. if there is any problems internally you'll pick them up earlier rather than later.
2. Initial run in will always produce unwanted foreign particles and contamination in the lube system.
3. Initial run in will cause more heat and consume the oil additives and qualities faster.

Some folk drop initial oil a lot sooner than 500, two or even three oil changes before 1000 isn't unreasonable if ya wanna keep the donk clean.

Looks like I opened a can of worms with this question    seems like there are some very different opinions on the subject.

I think I'll take the middle road and do one oil change at 300kms and then take it in for the full service at 1000kms.

I dont wont to get into a debate about when you should change your fluids, there's enough good  info out there for you to make that call.  With regards to the engine oil change,  whenever you do it,  I belive it is good practice to check inside the old oil filter and check for any nasties that may be caught in the mesh filter.  As an example, small yellow pieces may give you for warning of a cam tensioner starting to break down , etc.  Another good idea is to check your sparkplugs when servicing , it gives another  reasonable idea how things are going inside.   Just my 2c worth !!!        

my new motor, 5 minutes, 50km. 300km, 500km, 1500km oil and filter including draining the coolers.
do it which ever way meets your needs

Blah

The manufacturer has a better idea then average joe, so i go by his reconmendation. I live in the country approx. 300ks from the dealer, so i get it done when i go into town. Sometimes under most times over the mechanic said  aslong as it is close it is all ok. Commonn sense is king.

The way i see it a filter and a few litres of oil is cheap insurance for a $4000 motor, i change my oils in every vehicle i own every 3-4000 klms purely due to the environment i live in. as for running in the engine i used to change it  straight after the first lot of heat cycles then 100klms then 500klms then 1000klms always with a quality filter not cheap crap. for the first 2500klms i always used mineral based never full synthetic and has worked for me. just my opinion on what works for me

It's interesting to reflect on the recommendations of a few years back, when engines were producing far less power and torque, and also the tolerances that were accepted as appropriate.
For a whole lot of reasons, engines that produced higher than normal numbers were deemed to be "high performance " engines and the tolerances employed were deemed to be "race tolerances ". and significantly when related to air cooled donks.

Manufacturers today are striving to offer high performance as well as long engine life, the performance and output is much higher nowadays, but it's worth considering the fine tolerances still used to achieve the longevity of todays engines.

Modern machining methods along with better lubricants both add to the possibility of having the best of both worlds, high performance and long component life.

If you're happy with following the manufacturers recommendations, and supporting their business of supplying replacement parts you will probably be more than happy tagging along with the average Joe, but my guess is that seeing as you've outlaid a substantial amount of cash to own something special, you'll most likely want to keep it that way for as long as you can before supporting the dealers workshop and spare parts department.

As far as all the worn off high spots, small metal particles, and contaminates supposedly ending up in the oil filter, ask yourself this, what is all that stuff that is collected on a magnetic sump drain plug, what is all that grey paste looking stuff that accumulates in in the sharp corners of casings,,, and best of all, how many primaries and gear boxes have you seen that have a filter attached to them ?

Thanks rider, I'm planning on doing the oil and filter at around the 300km mark.  Are you saying I should change the primary and trans fluids as well at this time?

The most amount of "bedding in" wear and contaminants deposited to the lubricant is going to happen in the first few hundred Kilometers.

The most rapid depletion of the oil qualities is also going to occur during this period due to "tight" components and higher than normal temperatures.

For what the oil is worth, I wouldn't hesitate, I'd much rather see those contaminants go into the waste department rather than circulate through the machine for another thousand Kilometers or so.

Peace of mind and being able to visually check the condition of the oil is just a bonus.
You don't want to get run-in oil analyzed cause it would scare you.

On my own bikes ( many Harleys over the last 20 years )

1st oil change 250 K's

2nd oil change 1000 K's

3rd oil change 2000 k's ( by this time 100% wide open throttle "if required " haha...)

Then every 4000 K's

oil AND filter each time

I've run several Harleys to over 70,000 K's and NEVER had lifter troubles / oil consumption problems / blue smoke blowing etc etc

I've seen all of these problems and more on mate's and associates bikes over the years

Oh , and for what it's worth I've used synthetic oils all those years , often just Mobil 1 " car oil " bought in bulk at " Supercheap 20% off days "

I also buy filters by the box of 24 , from ebay delivered to my home address. ( I do service A LOT of other guy's bikes from home ! )

LATE EDIT Yes , I have the same oil change regime on any new car I buy as well. I don't buy that many cars and after the first 2 changes it's every 10,000 K's . Our " current " 2002 Suzuki hatch has 200,000 klicks up now and still has no oil usage and does 43MPG . I'll change it when it eventually dies !!

Do people carry on like this with their new car that propley cost more to buy

 

No but it does have a lot more moving parts running at tighter tolerances than the v-twin.

Millions of people round the world running cars, trucks, tractors, bikes etc all changing oils at the recommended time without problems but each to their own.

 

Products like Mobile 1 are a very good oil but no manufacturer of bikes will recommend it. The reason being it has friction modifiers that are not suited to wet clutches. It can cause the clutch to slip. I may be wrong and I am no expert so I stand to be corrected. Any contaminants from oli should be cleared out as early as possible, that makes sense but coming off jap super bikes I have never read so much paranoia about oils. Ive owned bikes with twice the power and spin to 13000 rpm and I just sent it to the dealer when it was time. Fuck me, do we all ride ticking time bombs?

Woolies home brand oil
Engine oil once a year
Primary and gear box evey 5 years
And get 4cents a liter off 91fuel with the docket i get
I love woolies

Well I dumped my oil at 200kms and it looked as clean as a whistle. No sign that it had even broken down in the slightest, no visible contaminants in the oil or on the magnetic drain plug.

Next time I don't think I will bother. Just ride it until the first service IMO.

You usually only see swarf on the primary and gearbox drain plugs ( and you DO see it on them !!)

In the case of the engine oil , the swarf , if there is any , is well caught by the oil filter

Still a good idea to have changed it as soon as you have done IMO

The old oil question.

Every new car and bike I had, I change myself only at the recommended intervals. If I was to sell my bike at 100,000 kms, and you sold yours at 100,000 as well, I would have spent squillions less if your changing oil more often than schedule.. The only way you can tell the the health of the engine oil is by laboratory analysis at oil change intervals. Costs too much for ordinary Joe blow. If someone recomends changing oil in shorter intervals than recomended, ask for the lab analysis. Otherwise its unverified rubbish

Anything else is pure unproven comment based on what someone says who has never had oil analysed every km schedule or even once. Trucks and big engines have there oil analised due to cost of engnes but mainly due to minimise down time. And even then the tests are done to report on oil condition additives ect and recommend oil change schedule or hours. Harleys run in wildly variable engine temps and climates, IE in city stop start traffic or cold climates, No one can tell you what Harlys oil additive specs are, but you could reasonably assume there oil forumla is for wildly varied engine temp  use otherwise thered be huge warranty concerns.

You wont see lamborgini, bmw, or any high end car recommending oil changes except at recommended intervals and definately not every few hundred kays at run in times.

Ive yet to see any bike at 100,000 kays thats in any better nick than any other bike at 100,000 kays that is used as a daily ride and maintained by kms schedule compared to changing oil more regularly than schedule.  If you change oil more than km schedule, All your doing is making oil companies richer with no proven benifit to you.

If folk suggest changing at lower km schedule, then weres the data to show the so called benifit.

I would only increase oil change intervals if day temps were at 35 plus C and nights below freezing point due to vacume effect of engine ingesting water vapour as the earth cools at night to freezing. Otherwise dont waste your money as Australia has few cimate variable areas that experience that extreme from day to night.

All things being equal, save your cash, interval only and ride.

Of corse im not comparing a bike thats being flogged to one that hasnt at 100,000kays, or one thats had heavily modified engine horsepower gains. I wouldnt worry about a few metal particles on your drain plugs as long as it decreases with oil changes.If it dose increase with each oil change, its telling you something else is wrong and not the oil. 

Theres no perfect oil for all temp variables and thats why at the least, engine manufactures advise you to change oil at end of summer and winter if you do few engine hours across the seasons or one of the seasons. If someone has the good oil on oil, I love to read the data, cause Ide love my bikes engine to do half a million kays without a rebuild. Im told, unverified, that taxies do half a mill kays on one engine due to the fact that there engines rarly cool down.